3 point Retractable/Modern Seat Belts?

[Faraizim]

Does anyone have experience (tips, exact models, etc) of replacing the original seat belts with a modern 3-point retractable belt? I've seen them online for around $100 for a kit. I know that safety is relative with these cars, but thoughts on a modern seat belt--as I do carry precious cargo besides myself...

Appreciate any advice or relevant experience here.

Thanks

[Peter h]

look here

http://www.beetle.homepage.t-online.de/Einbau%20automatische%20Dreipunktgurte.htm

only in german

Peter

[Ulf]

I got these cheap ones from SLS (http://www.sls-hh-shop.de/index.php/cat/c3_Mercedes-Benz-230SL-250SL-280SL-Pagoda--R113-W113-.html/XTCsid/haaetivnktbeouuhhl20rpdli7#cat_98_position_90_prod_0) but the stalk for the passenger side is way too long to make sense in a Pagoda (perhaps I'm doing something wrong), but the drivers side took only 10 minutes to fix with a spanner...

[Faraizim]

Thanks for the links and posts. I've also seen these here, but obviously can't vouch for them:

http://www.autopartswarehouse.com/details/QQMercedes_BenzQQ280SLQQReplacementQQSeat_BeltQQ19681971QQUS-SBELT.html

[JamesL]

http://www.fdts-seatbelts.co.uk/

[Peter h]

i got my seat belt here
http://www.dbdepot.de/index.php?nav=4&lan=1&

Peter

[Michel Richard]

Mercedes has a kit for this.  It uses belts for another model but fits our Sl nice.  I've put a set in.  It is fairly involved and requires a bit of welding, but the results are quite nice.  There's an instruction sheet somewhere on this site (I'll try to find the link) and I was able to get everything from my local dealer.  Cost something like 700 $  or 800 $ last year.

Michel Richard

[jaymanek]

The Mercedes system is ok but not very stylish (all black plastic) and well over priced!
You could make the kit up with second hand seat belts from pretty much any 70's or 80's model Mercedes for next to nothing.

I am placing an order with FDTS and have specified a colour to match my interior and all chrome clasps, buckles (airoplane style) and retractor loops.

The cost will be no more than a dinner out with the family.

[JamesL]

I had ratty (well, mouse eaten...), black belts

I removed the three bolts, sent the whole lot to FDTS, and this is what I got back...I paid for webbing and new retractors only

[scoot]

I had ratty (well, mouse eaten...), black belts

I removed the three bolts, sent the whole lot to FDTS, and this is what I got back...I paid for webbing and new retractors only

The positioning of the retractor makes me wonder    a) how it is attached to the body    and  b) can you no longer remove the rear parcel shelves by taking out the thumb screws on the floor?      Or is this a Kinderseat car that doesn't have the two parcel shelf panels?  Could you add a picture of the center tunnel buckles?   Thanks!  Scott

[JamesL]

Kinderseat...

Will post buckle pics next week

[treedoc]

When we imported our 280SL from California it was still fitted with the origonal Kangol seat belts, whilst these were still in excellent condition to comply with Australia Car Design Rules, we were required to fit retractables

As you can see from the attached photo we used a short lenght of 50 x 50 x 5 mm angle iron with two 10 mm bolts high tensile trough the floor with a 50 x 5 mm flat plate under the floor the new belt drom is bolted to the vertical side of the angle iron. Along with the drums this is mounted under the removable panels behind the seats hard up against each side, completly out of sight where they carn't be damaged by other things.

We pulled back the carpet on the floor cover boards and shaved approx 4 mm off the wooden boards to allow clearence on the belts, we did not alter the carpets. We have now also fitted belt holders to our head rest support rods, saves fidling around trying to find the bealts once your in the car

[jaymanek]

does the belt not snag on the carpet on its way back into the retractor? Or did you file some wood away?

[CraigS]

When we imported our 280SL from California it was still fitted with the original Kangol seat Belts, whilst these were still in excellent condition to comply with Australia Car Design Rules, we were therefor required to fit retractables

As you can see from the attached photo we used a short length of 50 x 50 x 5 mm angle iron with two 10 mm bolts high tensile trough the floor with a 50 x 5 mm flat plate under the floor the new belt drum is bolted to the vertical side of the angle iron. Along with the drums this is mounted under the removable panels behind the seats hard up against each side, completely out of sight where they can't be damaged by other things.

We pulled back the carpet on the floor cover boards and shaved approx 4 mm off the wooden boards to allow clearance on the belts, we did not alter the carpets. We have now also fitted belt holders to our head rest support rods, saves fiddling around trying to find the belts once your in the car

How did you get these complied ? The plate is supposed to be 60mm square and riveted, not bolted. Likewise, the height of the top buckle is supposed to be a specific height so that it comes down over your shoulder, not up and over, which would not be possible in an SL without making a stalk to increase the height, which would look pretty terrible. Having complianced several US imports (not SL's), I have had plenty of discussions with the compliance guys over the years regarding seat belts, so I am pretty sure of the requirements.

[treedoc]

Jaymanek, yes we filed the wood back about 4 mm where to belt emerges from the underfloor cavity

CraigS, our installation was approved by a licenced automotive engineering inspector. Australian Design Rules are not necessarily the same as with those of other jurisdictions.
That said, I know which method I would prefer to trust my life with, one using a couple of 10 mm high tensile bolts with a thick backing plate under the floor panel all heavily coated with zinc epoxy paint or something held together with some pop rivets.

If you look at the second picture you will see we utlised the standard top seat belt swiveling mount to stop the beat from sagging on the floor, we also fitted belt guides to the head rest rods.

[clunker]

I bought a pair of basic three point retractable belts (black, 76.95 ea) from seatbeltsplus and installed them in under 20 minutes in my US '69 280SL (http://www.seatbeltsplus.com/product/WSCH14134C-6.html). I ordered the short (6") rigid end release.

I removed the original three point Kangol belts and mounted the retractor unit just behind the seat near the floor, in the same mount point used by the Kangol lower anchor (all bolts/threads fitted exactly). I then mounted the loose end of the retractable belt on the floor in an unused bolt point in the floor directly beneath where I mounted the retractor unit (this time I reused the lower profile head Kangol bolt) - this unused bolt hole has a reinforcement plate in place and was obviously there ready for another belt mounting system (it had a plastic cover screw). Then I mounted the retractable belt shoulder guide point in the same place as the Kangol shoulder mount - but added a spare nut (in the belt kit) as a spacer so it sat properly. Finally I mounted the rigid end release in the same mount point as used by the Kangol end release belt, on the transmission tunnel (again reused the lower profile head Kangol bolt); I mounted it 'backwards' (ie release facing inward) so as to not damage the wooden tray - works fine.

The new belts work well, and feel much more secure. The simple installation is very tidy (and reversible) with no drilling, no cutting and no welding - and uses M-B mount points. The seats lose about an inch of maximum rear travel due to the retractor unit being just behind, but that in practice made no difference to me (I am 6').

[66andBlue]

... The seats lose about an inch of maximum rear travel due to the retractor unit being just behind, but that in practice made no difference to me (I am 6').

Hmm ... one inch. Can you still get to the front bolts in the tracks to remove the seat when necessary?

[Garry]

Alfred

I did a similar fit, I believe my loss is more than an inch, more like two, and have been able to get the seats out and in since then.  Difficult to get to the bolts but can be done.

One problem I strike is that the belt wants to twist due to its placement and I suspect under the timber cover with a properly fitted bolt hole and plate is probably a better place to stop this occurring.

Garry

[stickandrudderman]

My preferred supplier:
http://www.quickfitsbs.com/
They have always given me excellent service

I always specify all chrome fittings unless the customer specifies otherwise. Not original but look great.

[jameshoward]

There is a MB service bulletin for fitting retractable belts into the 113. I have it (it's 8MB - I think Mike sent it to me - anyway, I got it from someone here). There is a fitting kit using MB part numbers that is also produced. It consists of 2 plates with screws attached, and a number of special bolts.

I got the kit and using the bulletin fitted the belts easily. There is no need to weld (although the tech bulletin process suggests welding). I got the belts from ebay. The receiver supplied was too long (at 200mm on a flexible fitting) because the seat sits so low and so close to the receiver. I changed these for 100mm ones that were on a metal plate. These aren't perfect because the release button is inside against ones' lap rather than on the outside. I know that Naj has found an excellent supplier and can get the right receivers. This is on my list of jobs to do. (Near the bottom!).

So what? In summary:

The belts are available from multiple locations. I'd recommend you get receivers that are 100mm or the receiver will be against your hip or worse.

I have a late 230. All of the holes for the belts (shoulder, tunnel (for receiver) and anchor (for the retractable reel) were already present and done at the time of the build (my car is a US import but had 2 point lap belts from new, that I replaced). The reel fits under the parcel shelf (no cutting required) but you will need to cut the metal curved plate that covers the B-pillar.

I have photos somewhere.

PM me with an email address if you want the MB bulletin. I'm afraid I don't have the PN of the fitting kit to hand easily.

JH