Pagoda SL Group
W113 Pagoda SL Group => General Discussion => Topic started by: Ben on October 28, 2004, 07:07:33
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Hello everyone,
After hijacking an earlier thread "Chin Spoiler", and with great help & photos from Charles I still need some more info !
My car still lets water into the area behind the seats. First the wells under the wooden shelves will fill up and it will slosh around and spill over. The water aapears to make its way through some of the seams in the soft top compartment, and also drains back into the boot area. Now I can and WILL use seam sealer around this area but there are other concerns.
Its not so much that it rains ALL the time over here its just that showers are frequent and heavy, so the volume in a shart period will cause problems.
Let me see if I have this straight. Firstly with the top up there should only be a small amount of water entering the soft top lid seal area, and this should find its way through the little hole in the rubber that lines up with the hole in the metal seal channel and find its way down to the hole under the chrome trim ahead of the rear wheel area..........correct ?
This is the area that Charles has modified with the little tubes, and re-routed down into the wells underneath the wood shelves.
It seems that the volume of wtare I have to deal with will easily overcome this and spill into the soft top box, I think this can happen much quicker if I am driving and the water enters near the chrome trim at the "B" post.
So.....when water is INSIDE the soft top box..........where should it go ?
Questions
1. Where are the factory holes and what are the large round grommets for ?
2.Are there metal rib like flanges from the bracket rearwards towards the wheel arch intrusion, and is this designed to contain water and [prevent it from travelling around the soft top area?
3.Is there anything preventing water from entering the boot area, like another ridge ?
Any help or photos would be appreciated !
Download Attachment: (http://images/icon_paperclip.gif) soft top drain holes.jpg (http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/Ben/20041028976_soft%20top%20drain%20holes.jpg)
21.88 KB
Regards,
Ben in Ireland.
'64 230SL 4sp.
'03 CLK Kompressor
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Ben:
The smaller hole, on the right in your photo, is a drain hole and there is another one like it in the same place on the driver side. If you remove the upholstered panels on each side of the space back of the seats after removing the wood floor panels first you can feel, and see, a short metal tube extending down on the underside of where each of those little holes are. Any water collected in the soft top storage area is , I guess, supposed to find its way to these holes, then free fall down each side and behind the kick panels and out little rectangular openings at the bottom of the kick panels. If you look at the bottom edge of the kick panel where it overlaps the floor sheet metal you will see these little drainage openings about 1/8 inch by 1/2 inch long. Personally I would prefer to put a length of rubber hose onto the short tubes and provide a positive path for the water to follow until it exits the car - however I have not done this yet myself. I don't know what the larger rubber grommet is for that is circled in your picture. I've got one but I have never taken it out.
Les 1970 280SL
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Thanks for that info !
There are definitely NO holes in this area on my 230 !!
Was it a 280 thing only ?
Does everyone have these ?
Regards,
Ben in Ireland.
'64 230SL 4sp.
'03 CLK Kompressor
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In reply to Les...
When restoring cars I have found gromments in holes that appear to be in a panel for no apparent reason. I asked a guy I know who used to work for MG he said that alot of times they are put in panels, especially structural ones, so that they fit on the jigs/assembly frames as they build the car body. THis is so that everything "lines up" correctly, once assembled the plug goes in and that's that.
He thinks that these days you find less of these "mystery" plugs as the robotic assembly procedures have improved and changed over the years.
Finally often "structural" panels are common across several vehicles and it is possible that the hole might be for wires/pipes etc for one vehicle but not another
Cheers
Malc
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Malc,
Thanks, that's what I like about this forum - you learn something every day!
Ben,
I think all the 280's have the two little drainage holes but am not for sure. I have a friend in town who owns a 1969 280SL and his car has them. Maybe some others will comment on this.
BTW,
In the previous post I referred to "kick" panels - what I meant to say was "rocker" panels. Sorry for the confusion!
Have a nice day everybody!
Les 1970 280SL
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quote:
Originally posted by signalred280sl
Malc,
Thanks, that's what I like about this forum - you learn something every day!
Ben,
I think all the 280's have the two little drainage holes but am not for sure. I have a friend in town who owns a 1969 280SL and his car has them. Maybe some others will comment on this.
BTW,
In the previous post I referred to "kick" panels - what I meant to say was "rocker" panels. Sorry for the confusion!
Have a nice day everybody!
Les 1970 280SL
Hey Les
Rocker panels? I think you mean sills ;)
(Limey speak)
Malc
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Anybody else care to comment on whether or not they've got their hole !! [:o]
Regards,
Ben in Ireland.
'64 230SL 4sp.
'03 CLK Kompressor
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quote:
Originally posted by Ben
Hello everyone,
.../... I still need some more info!
Ben in Ireland.
'64 230SL 4sp.
'03 CLK Kompressor
You are missing the two strong springs, one each side, for your soft top mechanism. M-B part No 113 779 0436
/Hans in Stockholm
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quote:
Originally posted by mbzse
quote:
Originally posted by Ben
Hello everyone,
.../... I still need some more info!
Ben in Ireland.
'64 230SL 4sp.
'03 CLK Kompressor
You are missing the two strong springs, one each side, for your soft top mechanism. M-B part No 113 779 0436
/Hans in Stockholm
...Probably has broken spring ear links... common problem..
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The rubber tubes often plug up with dirt and you need to blow them out so they can drain. Np reason for that much water to be getting in so they're likely plugged.
Daniel G Caron
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quote:
Originally posted by mbzse
quote:
Originally posted by Ben
Hello everyone,
.../... I still need some more info!
Ben in Ireland.
'64 230SL 4sp.
'03 CLK Kompressor
You are missing the two strong springs, one each side, for your soft top mechanism. M-B part No 113 779 0436
/Hans in Stockholm
Hans,
Hi. Can you provide a picture for Ben and the rest of us?
No picture here:
http://index.php?topic=2084
Some pictures here:
http://index.php?topic=2032
Rodd
Powell, Ohio, USA
1966 230SL, Euro, Auto, Leather, both tops
1994 E420
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Hey Ben. Unfortunately away from my car right now, so I can only add a little. I do know that my early 230 has holes in the lowest corner of the cavities that are covered by the rear shelf panels. Any water that made its way in there would drain out. Not sure exactly where its next stop would be...
James
63 230SL
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quote:
Originally posted by rwmastel
quote:
Originally posted by mbzse
Ben wrote:Hello everyone,
.../... I still need some more info!
Hans wrote: You are missing the two strong springs, one each side, for your soft top mechanism. M-B part No 113 779 0436
/Hans in Stockholm
Hans, Can you provide a picture for Ben and the rest of us?
Rodd Powell, Ohio, USA
Sure, see attached. Also, if one looks at this illustration, springs are part No 76
http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/msquared/200481421406_IN02_0430.jpg
Download Attachment: (http://images/icon_paperclip.gif) soft_top_spring.jpg (http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/mbzse/200410312567_soft_top_spring.jpg)
36.22 KB
/Hans in Stockholm
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Actually the pictures are NOT of my car they are belong to Charles, the car discussed in the "Chin Spoiler" thread. My car has the big springs so no probs there !
quote:
The rubber tubes often plug up with dirt and you need to blow them out so they can drain. Np reason for that much water to be getting in so they're likely plugged.
Dan, are thse standard rubber tubes ( like washer jet tubes)and what other hardware should be there ? The actual holes, do they have grommets or are there little ports brazed to the body ?? And I assume the tubes extend down to the sills ?
quote:
I do know that my early 230 has holes in the lowest corner of the cavities that are covered by the rear shelf panels. Any water that made its way in there would drain out. Not sure exactly where its next stop would be...
James I'd like to hear more on this because I definitely do not have holes down here, although there does appear to be a thick layer of hammerite paint and plenty of waxoyl, so maybe the holes are covered. But where would they drain to ?
If anybody can add to this it would be great !. I'm going to go out right now and try to take some photos of this area. Unfortunately I have put my hard top on (and adjusted the windows yesterday ....no more drafts), so I cant photo the soft top compartment.
In the photo the front of the car is toward the bottom of the photo.....where should the holes be?
Anyone with a 230 have the drain holes in the soft top area, and these tubes ??
Regards,
Ben in Ireland.
'64 230SL 4sp.
'03 CLK Kompressor
Download Attachment: (http://images/icon_paperclip.gif) RearCompA.JPG (http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/Ben/200411185335_RearCompA.JPG)
28.78 KB
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quote:
Dan, are thse standard rubber tubes ( like washer jet tubes)and what other hardware should be there ? The actual holes, do they have grommets or are there little ports brazed to the body ?? And I assume the tubes extend down to the sills ?
Anyone else able to answer please chime in !
Regards,
Ben in Ireland.
'64 230SL 4sp.
'03 CLK Kompressor
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Ben,
Yes, there are lots of holes in the old girl, unfortunately due to rot!
Oh dear :?
Malc