Distributor stuck - won't rotate

[Iconic]

My distributor (062) won't rotate so I can't adjust the timing.
The allen head bolt is loose and the hex head screw (for minor adjustment I believe) is loose too.
I have applied quite a bit if torque to the distributor in both directions and it won't budge.
It feels like it is welded onto the block.
I have also applied some penetrating oil. (Maybe not in the right spot??)
Can any of you help me???
Thanks.
Mark

[Allenh]

Don't panic.  The most likely cause IS the clamp where you loosened the allenhead cap screw.  If this has been clamped tight for a long time, it will grip the aluminum distributor housing like it was its last meal.  Use a large screwdriver and after removing that clamping screw, spread open that clamp.  Now check if it turns easily.  It should.  If not, all is still not lost.  If you get to this point, you would have to unstick the distributor from the aluminum gear cover.  If you used a good penetrating oil, NOT WD40, Take a blunt, solid and heavy metal object (a drift) and while holding it against the gear housing, rap on the drift with a steel hammer.  Strike firmly but not too hard.  The object is to provide some shock and vibration to loosen the parts.  Unless your Benz has been under water for a few years, this will work.  The execution is up to you. 

Good Luck

Allen

[Iconic]

OK Allen, now I am getting discouraged.
My clamp is loose to the point that I can jiggle it easily, but I stuck a screwdriver in there anyway and opened it up a mm or two.
How long of a drift do I need and at what angle? More up and down, or from the front of the engine (more horizontal).
I guess I don't completely get it.
I can't see too much access to being able to shock the gear cover.
I did go ahead and try to shock the distributor housing (while putting a torque into the distributor) by using a screwdriver against the edge of the screws that hold he spring metal clamps for the distributor clamp. I hit pretty hard in both directions.
NO LUCK.
I'm soaking it some more. I assume soaking above and below the clamp is the correct place to soak.
By the way, I'm using Sea Foam, Deep Creep. I've had very good results with this.
Any more help out there. It really feels like it is welded solid to the engine.
I'm starting to feel not so smart. 
Mark

[jeffc280sl]

Mark,

Try a different approach.  The pinch plate that is used to set the distributor timing in secured to the engine by a single 10mm bolt.  The bolt is located under the distributor on the battery side.  Loosen this bolt and gently pull the distributor up and then loosen the bolt some more until the pinch plate and in turn the distributor are free.  Once the assembly is removed you can more easily spread the pinch plate to separate it from the distributor body.

[Benz Dr.]

I've seen this happen before and I always get them out. Penatrating oil is usless in most cases. In really stuborn one I use a bit of heat on the outer housing which always works. Sometimes I tap away on the bottom of the distrbutor housing and sometimes I tap on the small braket that is used to do finer timimg adjustments. Whatever you do, alway hit against something solid And use two hammers - one placed on the area you want to hit and the other to hit the other hammer.
It will come out......

[Allenh]

Dr. Benz,  My point in using a drift.  If you ever worked around a machine shop the term would be familiar.  It would be like the double hammer. 

It is a little more work, but the timing cover can be removed with the distributor on it.  at that point, it would be easier to beat the hell out of it like the proverbial "Red-headed Stepchild" .  All of the screws and the cover can be removed without disturbing thr P/S pump.  If there is a good gasket on the cover, you can probbly clean it with solvent and reuse. Just use a sealant on the screws.

Good luck!

Allen

[scp]

I had the same issue with mine - I ended up using a pipe wrench.  I had soaked it with penetrating oil for a few days and got nowhere.  I removed everything from the outside of the housing, grabbed it with a wrench and (with a significant amount of force) I got it to budge a bit.  I sprayed more penetrating oil and the next day budged it a bit in the other direction.  After three days of this it became loose and was easy to remove to clean.  Put it back together and set the timing to spec - car has never run better.  Good luck.

-SCP

[Benz Dr.]

In a former life I was a machinist of sorts so I know most of the tools and terms. Everything is very different today and all of the old time tools get little use now.
I use heat on stuborn things like rusted bolts, brake line fittings, corroded screws in aluminium housings and stuck brake drums. Like anything, it's an acquired skill that you get good at over time.
 I'd like to use heat on something really stuborn that I'm working on right now but the result would be that I'd catch fire and burn up everything around me.
 So, I'll keep my matches at home.

[Iconic]

Dr. Benz, I am not comfortable with flame since there is caked on grease, wet penetrating oil, battery cables, and other wires all over the place. I wouldn't know how to use the heat.
SCP, My distributor housing is aluminum. Is your steel. I'm afraid of cracking, crushing, or even just making the housing look like junk if I grab it with a pipe wrench (right now it is very pretty ... but it won't rotate !!).
Jeff, I've loosened the bolt, but the distributor won't go in the up direction either.
All, great suggestions. I haven't tried all of them yet. I'm doing the easiest first.
I would love to hit it in the up direction. But, I can't figure out how to get under it to hit it up.
I tried a little more tonight. I have to try more later ... or bring it to my mechanic. Too bad, so far, I'm the only one who worked on the car since I got it...
Thanks again and I'll keep you posted on my success/failures.
Mark

[graphic66]

If you got caked on grease clean it off. It will run cooler and be way easier to work on. I always find it easier to fix things clean. Sometimes when I am not sure how to do a job or where to start I just start cleaning and it all comes together.

[Iconic]

More good advice.
Thanks !!

[jeffc280sl]

The reason I said to loosen the bolt and then pull the distributor up is because the bolt may hit on the bottom on the distributor body as it is unthreaded.  Loosen the bolt as far as you can until it hits the body and then try to pull it up.  Then lossen the bolt some more until it is unthreaded.  With the bolt loose or out the only resistance is a rubber O ring on the distributor shaft.

[Allenh]

I mentioned earlier, take off the timing gear cover.  It is less difficult that your current strugging, and it will allow you to work on this problem much easier.  Just set the crankshaft on TDC first #1 cyl firing position, retiming for starting will be quite easy.

[Iconic]

Allen,
I can't get to this until next week. There is lots of caked on oil/dirt that I need to clean off. I tried to find the timing cover in the manuals and on this forum and haven't found a picture of it.
How many fasteners am I looking for?
Can I do it without pulling the radiator? I need to take a better look at that area.
About how big is the timing cover?
Jeff, I will first try removing the bolt that holds the clamp with the allen head.
Thanks again guys. Sorry I'm so slow. I don't want to break anything and I have two kids that slow me down.
Mark

[jeffc280sl]

Hi Mark,

Here is a pic of what your working on.  The distributor is held in place by parts 73 and 74.  The bolt you want to remove goes through the smaller hole and the distributor body goes through the larger hole.  The distributor is inserted into the timing cover which is also shown in the pic.

Good luck

[Allenh]

Just curious, did you ever get the distributor feed up?  I missed getting back to you. Local storms took out my DSL and I was blind.

Allen

[Iconic]

I've been swamped, so I haven't had at it since Jeff posted that great exploded view.
I hope to clean up the area this week and go for it.
The timing gear cover is definitely my next step.
Thank you !
Mark

[Iconic]

OK, I must ask. I looked closer at this last night.
Can I remove the timing gear cover without taking off the hood (bonnet), radiator, and/or battery.
I guess the battery would be no big deal.
I just figured I would ask since I am sitting here at work (DURING LUNCH) and can't work on the Pagoda right now anyway...
In case you couldn't tell, I sometimes have difficulty starting a project.
Mark

[jeffc280sl]

Hey Mark,

I suggest that you continue the efforts to remove the 10mm bolt.  This bolt secures the pinch plate to the engine.  With it removed nothing is holding the distributor in place.  You should be able to spin the distributor body and pull it up.  The hole in the pinch plate this bolt goes through is elongated so that one could do some fine timing changes without loosening the allen bolt.  Once the entire distributor is out of the car you can use a variety of tools to free the pinch plate from the body.

Good Luck

[Iconic]

Jeff,
Thanks for that exploded view you posted. It sure helps to see the parts without caked on grease.
FYI: The bolt is out with the washer. The allen head bold is loose by about 4 mm. The clamp has been coaxed open by about 3 mm. The pinch plate is not stuck to anything because it can jiggle around and rotate freely.
This is the point. The distributor is stuck. It won't pull out or rotate.
My next step will be to pull of the timing gear cover. For reasons of access, this seems like a big job.
Can someone who has done it with the engine in the car tell me what major items I must remove to gain access?
Mark

[jeffc280sl]

Hi Mark,

Now I understand what you are up against.  I thought the pinch plate was the problem but clearly it is not.  From experience Dr. Benz knew what the problem was.  I believe one of his suggestions was the tap on the pinch plate to try and free the distributor.  I think that means the allen bolt should be tight.  Use a sharpee to mark the distributor and pinch plate.  With the distributor secured with the pinch plate see if you can tap on the allen bolt to spin the distributor.  Check the alignment marks to see if you are just spinning the pinch plate on the distributor shaft. Try to work the distributor clockwise and counter clockwise in small increments.  Then try some upward force.

I'll try and find a pic of the timing cover so that you can see the bolt locations.  I think Allen said it can be removed without taking the power steering pump off.  No doubt you have a very tight work space if the fan and radiator are in place.

Here is a pic of the engine front without the timing cover.  Timing cover bolt locations are shown with red arrows.

[ja17]

Try a big pair of channel locks. Do not grip the distributor at the rim, but rather close to its bottom, where it is stronger. Rotate back and fourth. It should begin to free up.

[Iconic]

RESOLVED.
OK, I finally got to this and succeeded.
I pulled the battery out of easier access.
I was able to finally get it with a channel locks with a good grip.
Thank you all for your suggestions. If the channel locks didn't work, I was going to pull the timing cover next.
Wow, it felt like it was welded solid, but it eventually moved and I worked it back and forth as advised.
Timing is now set. I'm on to the full linkage adjustment!
Thanks again.
Mark

[Dash808]

Congratulations!   

Stubborn distributors...