Author Topic: Hubcaps (Read 10825 times)

keith · « **on:** February 28, 2011, 18:11:50 »

Can anybody give me the following information about my 1966 230SL:

I have noses on the wheels of my car and I would like to know if any centre hubcap would fit the wheel or do you need to have specific ones. I am about to purchase some hubcaps and would like to make sure that they are the correct ones for the model and year of my car.

Many Thanks

Keith

66andBlue · « **Reply #1 on:** February 28, 2011, 18:28:13 »

Keith,
The technical manual shows the differences and you might be able to find what you need to know:
http://www.sl113.org/wiki/WheelsTires/Hubcap

sandcrab59 · « **Reply #2 on:** February 28, 2011, 21:46:28 »

Keith:
I own a 67 2ooD and a 68 200D, these models have the same center hub caps as the 230 sl.
I have crossed matched them to my 250 sl and they are the same and fit.
Alfred do you agree?
Tom
Sandcrab59

66andBlue · « **Reply #3 on:** March 01, 2011, 02:45:15 »

Tom,
I am sorry but I have no clue what kind of hub caps are on 200D cars.

ja17 · « **Reply #4 on:** March 01, 2011, 06:53:57 »

Those small "hub caps" as on the 230SL first appeared on the 190SLs and 300SLs in 1955. In addition most of the ponton sedans of the era 180, 190, 219 sedans used the same hub caps. in the 60's as Sandcrab has indicated, many of the "finback sedans (180c, 190c, 200,220Sb, 230S, 300SE ) also some coupes and cabs, also used these hubcaps. Lastly they were used on some of the early W108 sedans like the 250S, SE, 300SE. That same small hub cap was used for decades on various diameter Mercedes wheels (13", 14" and 15" steel wheels). At some point some after-market supplier began supplying good stainless steel reproductions instead of chrome plated steel like the originals. I remember when those hub cap repros could be bought for $8.00 ea brand new. There are still lots of the small hub caps around used.
Now the solid chrome "beauty ring" is a different issue. The 190SLs had one, but theirs were for 13" diameters. Some of the sedans of the era used a 13" slotted chrome beauty ring. The 14" solid chrome beauty rings, like on your 230SL. could only be found on the early W108 cars like the 250S, SE or the 300 SE. So these 230SL style beauty rings are fairly scarce.

thelews · « **Reply #5 on:** March 01, 2011, 13:05:10 »

Quote from: ja17 on March 01, 2011, 06:53:57

The 14" solid chrome beauty rings, like on your 230SL. could only be found on the early W108 cars like the 250S, SE or the 300 SE. So these 230SL style beauty rings are fairly scarce.

I have the same beauty ring on my early 250 SL. The change came during the 250 SL model years ('67-'68) when the 113 cosmetics changed to the 280 SL style. These beauty rings can be found as aftermarket generics for very reasonable money from a place like Nationwide Hubcaps (Ebay). Only the most sophisticated and discerning of 113 afficionados would pick up on the difference. They are also available from MB for about $150 apiece. I know I have side by side pictures of the two of them. I'll look.

sandcrab59 · « **Reply #6 on:** March 01, 2011, 14:04:41 »

Good catch by Joe.
In the frozen north as it is now (New England) I will track out into about 30 inches of snow and check the outer rings as Joe stated and see if the 200D rings fit my 67 250 SL.
Joe has a little more experience than I do (I Started in 1972) so I would at this time say he is correct.
I will let you know. If the 230 SL has 13 inch rims than the later rings will not fit because they are 14 inch.
BY the way these rings and center hub caps are in the trunks I was wise enough not to leave them on the cars in the woods.
Tom
Sandcrab59

thelews · « **Reply #7 on:** March 01, 2011, 15:23:35 »

The 230 SL has 14" wheels. The hubcaps, however, fit both 13 and 14 inch wheels, just the beauty rings are different sizes.

114015 · « **Reply #8 on:** March 01, 2011, 23:55:44 »

Quote

I have the same beauty ring on my early 250 SL. The change came during the 250 SL model years ('67-'68) when the 113 cosmetics changed to the 280 SL style.

That's correct.
All 230 and all 250 SLs had the small hub caps 186 401 00 25 - first introduced on some W186 Adenauers.
The same holds true for the separate 14'' beauty rings, which is typical for the 230/250 SL and the early W108 as Joe mentioned absolutely correct.

John is right, the change came in late 1968 ... when the 280 was introduced.
Early 280 SLs had the setup with small cap & ring but only up to serial 000044.
From 000045 on they had the one-piece hubcap.

That's what the parts lists tell (10202 280 SL Edition C as of January 1972). And the "Engelen" with its well renown change history.

This makes the early 280 the most interesting one: old hubcaps and red taillights. Together with Euro version & ZF S 5/20 = perfect.

Achim
(only 230ies)

114015 · « **Reply #9 on:** March 02, 2011, 15:13:51 »

Dear Connoisseurs,

Please,
Where does this info (in our Wiki Alfred referred to) come from?

Quote

The change from the earlier to the later style hubcap took place around May 1967 on the 250SL Fahrgestell Endnummer 002525 Manual and 002468 auto (see Production Months).

Personally, I do not agree with this above statement.
The parts list (see above) info opposes to this.
I have to admid though, that I first have to check the info in the "Engelen's" tables again to prove.

Alfred,
Do you happen by chance to have any deviating comments about what I am claiming?
Otherwise I would like to correct the info in Wiki then.

Thanks to all,
Achim

66andBlue · « **Reply #10 on:** March 02, 2011, 17:48:11 »

Achim,
again I have no clue, I am not the author of this entry.
You can find out who put it there by clicking on the "History" tab on the left.
But by all means, correct it if it is wrong, that's what a Wiki is for.

114015 · « **Reply #11 on:** March 02, 2011, 18:38:30 »

Hello Alfred, hello all!

Stupid me!
I have always believed that the common Mercedes parts lists (of our cars) are common for all over the world.

This is certainly true for the 230 SL lists (10062, 10097 and 10126) but I am not more so sure about the 250-280 parts lists (10202, Parts list W113 edition C, as of January 1972).
Although it is the only commonly known paper parts list for the 250/280 SL (latest edition, edition C) it does not contain the typical US assorted parts .... what the 230 lists still do (did).

So, my question to the experts (Joe, Alfred, Dan, Tom Colitt, etc.):

Is (or was) there a separate US edition of the parts list other than the list enumerated with '10202'?

I don't speak about the previous versions but just a specific US list that shows all the typical features like sealed beam headlights, side marker lenses, English instruments, shut-off relais etc. etc. without being used to refer to the wealth of "special equipment" lists?

I know that the above mentioned 10202 contains also all the RHD parts but it misses the US parts.

I never crossed the way of "such an US edition" during my years in the States.
Do you know better than me?

Thanks a lot
and
Best

Achim
(currently learning again about the Pagodas)

66andBlue · « **Reply #12 on:** March 02, 2011, 20:25:06 »

Quote from: 114015 on March 02, 2011, 18:38:30

... Is (or was) there a separate US edition of the parts list other than the list enumerated with '10202'? ...

Yes there is, usually a black cover marked '10808' for 250SL/280SL US cars.
A few weeks ago one sold on eBay for about $120 if I remember correctly, still too expensive for my taste.

114015 · « **Reply #13 on:** March 02, 2011, 20:34:14 »

Great !

Thanks a lot, Alfred,
I did not know that.
$ 120 for a (good) paper list appears appropriate to me, that's about € 90 and as such a bit less than the new factory reprints were from MB when they were still available (I believe they are currently NLA but don't know for sure).

Best,

Achim

thelews · « **Reply #14 on:** March 02, 2011, 22:37:04 »

Quote from: 114015 on March 02, 2011, 20:34:14

Great !

Thanks a lot, Alfred,
I did not know that.
$ 120 for a (good) paper list appears appropriate to me, that's about € 90 and as such a bit less than the new factory reprints were from MB when they were still available (I believe they are currently NLA but don't know for sure).

Best,

Achim

Send me an email. I'll send you PDFs of the manual

Peter van Es · « **Reply #15 on:** March 03, 2011, 12:23:28 »

Quote from: 114015 on March 02, 2011, 15:13:51

Where does this info (in our Wiki Alfred referred to) come from?

That info probably comes from a message in the old yahoo group... hard to trace. I remember I sort of edited the whole weels and tyres section together, culling information from a whole bunch of sources.

If you know differently, please change the Wiki entry, and indicate the source of the info!

Peter

ja17 · « **Reply #16 on:** March 04, 2011, 04:31:13 »

Hello Achim,

Very interesting information on the very early and very few 280SLs with the early hub caps and beauty rings !

Garry · « **Reply #17 on:** March 04, 2011, 09:06:46 »

Achim,

Like Joe, I am interested in your very early 280's with the trim ring given that i have an early 280.

Do ou know at what build number they stopped the trim and went to the one piece?

Garry

66andBlue · « **Reply #18 on:** March 04, 2011, 18:21:40 »

Garry,
the info is in Achim's reply #8:
"Early 280 SLs had the setup with small cap & ring but only up to serial 000044.
From 000045 on they had the one-piece hubcap."
Your car is not among them, correct?

Garry · « **Reply #19 on:** March 04, 2011, 21:48:48 »

Hi Alfred,

I missed that in Achims reply and no mine was a February 69 car and not in the first 44 unfortunately as I really like the two piece trims, I think they look much nicer.

I will just have to buy a 230 or 250!!!

Garry

114015 · « **Reply #20 on:** March 04, 2011, 23:00:24 »

Hello Garry,

Quote

... and no mine was a February 69 car and not in the first 44 unfortunately as I really like the two piece trims, I think they look much nicer.
I will just have to buy a 230 or 250!!!

No,
you don't need to get a 230/250 only because of the two-piece hub cap chrome...

Which rims do you have? Do you still have the 108 400 0002 rims? Or later ones?
If the first ones you can easily retrofit the cap/chrome ring assembly. If not you would need to search for a set of decent rims from an early W108 parts car or so.

OK, the early cap/beauty ring assembly would not be historically absolutely correct on your car but you could always go back to one-piece hubcaps ... for the shows or so.

Most important is that you still have a VIN going with the all-red-taillights

... or ... better to say, the all-red-taillights with the amber turnsignal light, i.e. the 113 820 0364 and 0464s.

and not the later ... 1564/1664s which I personally disli.... well ... uhm the earlier ones are a bit nicer.

Best,

Achim

Garry · « **Reply #21 on:** March 05, 2011, 00:14:39 »

Hi Achim

When I first brought the 280 had the all red tail lights. To get the transfer of registration they were required to be changed to the red/orange turn. At that time I did not recognise the value of them and gave the old ones away when I changed them over!!!!!! but got the earlier red/orange ones in their place.

My 280 is in a workshop at the moment replacing some leaky seals and hoses so I cannot get access to check the wheels.

And I am in the process of trying to buy a 230 in California, with the help of Alfred, to use for PUB and then take home. Unfortunately it does not have the trim rims either but has the Bunt alloy wheels and the buy is not going that well as I think someone has beaten me (again) to buy. RHD cars last about 24 hours on the selling block so you have to be really quick and with it now being the weekend, it is going against me.

Cheers
Garry

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Author Topic: Hubcaps (Read 10825 times)

keith