Author Topic: Differences between auto and manual motors  (Read 4314 times)

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Differences between auto and manual motors
« on: June 05, 2004, 01:18:55 »
Hi Everyone

I recently picked up a reasonably complete 230 SL motor which I intend to use for spares. It came off a manual non-power steering car and mine is an automatic with power steering. I realise that a motor from a manual 113 cannot be simply slotted into an automatic but I've been given conflicting information on the actual differences. One mechanic told me that you only have to change the flywheel and another said that the whole crankshaft/flywheel assembly has to be changed over. Naturally, one is a simple operation and the other quite involved. Can anyone illuminate me on the differences between these motors?

Thanks

Mark

1965 230 SL light blue, auto, RHD

Cees Klumper

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Re: Differences between auto and manual motors
« Reply #1 on: June 05, 2004, 05:49:30 »
On the 280 SL (which has a different design as far as balancing is concerned from the 230 SL) it's a straight swap. The engine that Joe Alexander and I rebuilt last year carries an "10" identifier i.e. manual, but it went straight into my car which is an automatic. I forget (...) now exactly which part had to be left out of the bell housing, but the automatic transmission bolted right on and it all functions perfectly. Really makes me wonder why Mercedes bothered to give different identifiers to these M130 engines at all (10 for manual and 12 for automatic).

Cees Klumper in Amsterdam
'69 white 280 SL automatic
« Last Edit: June 05, 2004, 05:49:58 by cees klumper »
Cees Klumper
1969 Mercedes 280 SL automatic
1968 Ford Mustang 302 V8
1961 Alfa Romeo Giulietta Sprint Coupe 1600
1962 FIAT 1500S OSCA convertible
1972 Lancia Fulvia Coupe 1.3
1983 Porsche 944 2.5
1990 Ford Bronco II

Benz Dr.

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Re: Differences between auto and manual motors
« Reply #2 on: June 05, 2004, 11:51:45 »
There is differences but most of them are external. I'm not sure if can just simply bolt the flywheel from an automatic 230 on to one that came with a standard. I know you have to ballance a standard flywheel to the crank if it's chamged from one engine to another so maybe it's the same with the auto. I've not ever encountered this in any books that I have so I'm not sure - should be

Daniel G Caron
1966 230SL 5 speed, LSD, header pipes, 300SE distributor, ported, polished and balanced, AKA  ''The Red Rocket ''
Dan Caron's SL Barn

1970  3.5 Coupe
1961  190SL
1985   300CD  Turbo Coupe
1981  300SD
2013  GMC  Sierra
1965  230SL
1967 250SL
1970 280SL
1988 560SEC

ja17

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Re: Differences between auto and manual motors
« Reply #3 on: June 05, 2004, 22:12:25 »
Hello Mark,


The crankshaft on the M127 230-SL engine's crankshaft is counterbalanced to the front vibration dampner and the flywheel. In other words, these four main bearing crankshafts are out of balance by themselves. To achieve balance, an out of balance vibration dampner and a out of balance flywheel are used. It  is just like adding wheel weights to an out of balanced wheel. So the vibration dampner and flywheel of the M127 engine have masses added (counter weights).

In comparison the seven main bearing crankshaft of the 250-SL and 280-SL are balanced in themselves. A balanced vibration dampner and a balanced flywheel are used with these crankshafts.

The automatic flywheels and standard flywheels in your 230-SL engines can be swapped as long as they are both 230-SL engines. The 250-SL, 280-SL standard and automatic flywheels can also be swapped in their respective engine series.

In all cases a transmission shaft centering bearing is installed in the crankshaft at the factory  for all standard transmission cars. This most be removed or added depending on which tranmissiion you use.

The flywheel to crankshaft bolts are different lengths for standard or automatics also.

Your spare standard transmission engine will work fine in your automatic 230-SL. You will need to remove the flywheel and extract the centering bearing out of the crankshaft. Your original automatic flywheel can be bolted up to your spare engine using the flywheel/crankshaft bolts from the automatic.

Before the change over, you can take the original counterbalaced automatic flywheel and the counterbalanced standard flywheel to a performance shop and have your automatic flywheel exactly counter balanced the same as the standard flywheel.

Joe Alexander
Blacklick, Ohio
Joe Alexander
Blacklick, Ohio
1969 Dark Olive 280SL
2002 ML55 AMG (tow vehicle)
2002 SLK32 AMG (350 hp)
1982 300TD Wagon turbo 4spd.
1963 404 Mercedes Unimog (Swedish Army)
1989 flu419 Mercedes Unimog (US Army)
1998 E430
1974 450SLC Rally
1965 220SE Finback

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Re: Differences between auto and manual motors
« Reply #4 on: June 07, 2004, 17:58:31 »
Thanks guys and especially Joe

A comprehensive explanation that finally makes sense. What amazes me is that I asked two different mechanics who have a great deal of experience with old Benzes and yet they couldn't give me this level of information. Although it's probably not a question they are often asked, they are supposedly the experts. Give me the combined knowledge of the Pagoda list any day.

Mark



1965 230 SL light blue, auto, RHD