FYI--ZF 5 speed trans.

[Benz Dr.]

Anyone had a 5 speed with a VIN on their car earlier than  017168? I think that puts my car somewhere around Oct '66 which is shortly after they had the 5 speed as an option.

[George Des]

Dan,

I'm 018043 and my data card has a build date in September 1966 so yours is sometime right before that.

George

[rocketman1]

Dan, your car was built in july of "66"*
In order to help with actual stats for the ZF's box's, Dan can you check your metal ZF tag, it should have (032) hand stamped in the top right hand corner. Then in the bottom right corner, your box will be hand stamped with a "number produced" around (350), that's my guess.**
Garry, since yours is an actual carded ZF S 5-20, Can you check your tag. It should be (064) and "number produced" around (135)
*/** This is info I got from our Tech. Manual, Production Stats, and the reprint from ZF's Production Data for All transmissions built for DB cars. Lets see how acurate the printed info is compaired to our cars.
Thanks
rocketman1

[George Des]

Mine is stamped -057 and 1675.

George

[Garry]

According to my data card it is numbered 3021  for a 10 March 1969 ex factory

Anyone here got my gear box???

[DaveB]

Anyone here got my gear box???

I hope not. Unlikely though, as the seller said he'd bought it in California (would you swap it for a new one if it was yours? )
I'm still not sure of the status of mine. I know there is something in that crate.

[Louis]

If ZF made 3700 units most of them were not installed in MB cars. My information tells me that Benz installed them in about 1,400 cars. 882 113's, 108's and some 111/112's. I think they made a few for 189 engined cars and I saw one once at the Meadowbrook car show that was a 300SE Cab.  Not only is this car rare, but the factory only instaled a total of three 5 speeds in that version, making it the rarest of the rare.

The one I saw belongs to MB - they know it's rare.

I own a 1967 300SE Coupe with a factory installed Zf 5 speed.

[Benz Dr.]

I was at a car show where MB had one of their cars on display. A 300SE Cab with 5 speed trans. I was told that it's one of three built making it a very rare car.

[Louis]

I was at a car show where MB had one of their cars on display. A 300SE Cab with 5 speed trans. I was told that it's one of three built making it a very rare car.

Benz Dr ,

1 of 3 M189 Cabriolets with a zf or 1 of 3 overall M189 cars including Coupes & Cab's ?
My car , a 1967 300se coupe , was owned since 1971 by Tom Sheppard and participated in many MBCA events and won many events too from the information I've gathered on it. Tom was good friends with Frank Mallory and Michael Egan who wrote the article about the S5-20 already mentioned earlier in this discussion.  Anyway , I'd like to zero in on the actual # of 'factory installed ' W112 car's with the S5-20 tranny. I'll report back , if I uncover any additional info. on this topic.

[rocketman1]

Louis, You could have the "brass Ring" with that transmission.    ie:1of3 built.
The actual ZF metal tag that's riveted to your transmission, WILL answer that question.
Your tag will be hand stamped after the 1025 000 in the top right corner with either 033 or 058 for the 300SE model car. If thats the case, it will be hand stamped with the numbers 534 up to 813 down in the bottom right hand corner of that tag.
If the hand stamped number in the top right is 069, Bingo, you have one of three built for the 300SE !!!!!!
Accordling it should be stamped down in the right corner 001 or 002 or 003. Hope you got it!!!
In any case, you have a Fantastic Classic MB with a rare or very rare Transmission from ZF.
Best Regards
rocketman1
PS: Please, let us know

[Benz Dr.]

300SE Cab's are already a rare car but in this case I'm talking only about that car. According to the MB guy on hand at the show, he told me this car was one of only three that had the 5 speed trans option. He seemed surprised that I even noticed that it had a 5 speed, the shift knob being the only indicator.
I didn't ask about the 300SE coupe but I suppose there were a few of those made as well. I've either read ot been told that MB outfitted roughly 1,400 cars with the 5 speed. It's all very rare stuff today. 

[Louis]

Louis, You could have the "brass Ring" with that transmission.    ie:1of3 built.
The actual ZF metal tag that's riveted to your transmission, WILL answer that question.
Your tag will be hand stamped after the 1025 000 in the top right corner with either 033 or 058 for the 300SE model car. If thats the case, it will be hand stamped with the numbers 534 up to 813 down in the bottom right hand corner of that tag.
If the hand stamped number in the top right is 069, Bingo, you have one of three built for the 300SE !!!!!!
Accordling it should be stamped down in the right corner 001 or 002 or 003. Hope you got it!!!
In any case, you have a Fantastic Classic MB with a rare or very rare Transmission from ZF.
Best Regards
rocketman1
PS: Please, let us know

I'll let you know. Worth noting is that Tom Sheppard , the previous owner of my car , may have replaced the original factory zf unit in the 1970's according to a entry in the paperwork I received with this car. I haven't read it since I bought the car several years ago but I vaguely remember reading something about it while I quickly went through the notes he kept . So this unit may be a replacement zf box ?

[rocketman1]

Louis, What ever the tag reads will stiil be great info for the group to have.
FYI, the only way to read the actual tag is to put it on a car lift. Even than you have to be a "monkey" to get your head up close to read it.
Mine is on page 4 of this thread, and thats after I pulled the complete transmission and had it on the bench!!!
Good luck
rocketman1

[George Des]

Here's are some thoughts regarding the hsitory of some of our ZF boxes.. If there were only about 900 or so ZF S 5-20 boxes produced for the MB 113s. I would wonder if Daimler Benz would be able to quickly determine what VIN a specific ZF serial number was originally put into. As meticulous as Daimler is I'm sure somewhere in their archives they have this information. This could help some of us add another piece to the puzzle on where our boxes may have come from if not indicated on the data card. Do any of our German members know how to pursue this? I would also suggest asking ZF if all S5-20 with the cast iron housing were provided to DB and if not to whom else, but they have been so unresponsive on other requests that I'm sure this would be a non-starter with them. Yeah still no response on the many e-mails I've sent them!

George

[ctm14]

Came across this listing on EBay.  Were there any ZF 280's in 71'?


 http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1971-mercedes-280sl-zf-5-speed-manual-trans-rare-low-pruduction-car-no-air-cond-/140785942582?pt=US_Cars_Trucks&hash=item20c77f0036#ht_686wt_948
 

[Benz Dr.]

Came across this listing on EBay.  Were there any ZF 280's in 71'?


 http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1971-mercedes-280sl-zf-5-speed-manual-trans-rare-low-pruduction-car-no-air-cond-/140785942582?pt=US_Cars_Trucks&hash=item20c77f0036#ht_686wt_948
 

I suspect that there were some made but they would be Euro spec cars. When MB changed to switch gear on the manual trans in mid 1969 to control the IP, they discontinued the 5 speed because it would have meant fabricating special brackets to hold the switches.
 Given the relatively low sales of the 5 speed they droped the option for NA. A few euro cars could have been imported that had their gauges and head lights changed, which mght lead one to believe otherwise, or that someone had friends in high places, but generally, they were no longer available in the USA or Canada after mid 1969.