E85 anyone?

[Raymond]

Brazil imports NO oil.  Zero.  I'm told they run most of their cars on E85, a mixture of 85% ethanol and 15% petroleum.  They also use LPG along with diesel and gasoline.  

I saw a woman from GM speak about the merits of E85 and she said it is easier to make higher octane fuel from sugar cane than from petroleum.  (Unfortunately the US plans to use corn and that is only 1/8th as efficient.) Does anyone have any idea how our cars would handle an alcohol diet?

Ray
'68 280SL 4-spd Coupe

[George Davis]

My guess is they wouldn't like E85.  Ethanol is oxygenated, meaning it carries extra oxygen with it, built into the ethanol molecules.  Modern cars with electronic feedback control injection systems can adapt to a fairly wide range of oxygenate levels in the fuel and adjust the air/fuel ratio accordingly.  The Pagoda injection pump simply injects a certain volume and has no way of knowing if the fuel is oxygenated or not, and no way of self-adapting even if it did.  I'm guessing they would run lean unless the IP were recalibrated for E85.

George Davis
'69 280 SL Euro manual

[psmith]

Way back when, I took a course on ethanol fuel and I still have a few books.  I'm still a fan, and I think you can get the new Mercedes as Flexible Fuel Vehicles.  

Here's what I remember.  Ethanol is a great fuel, it burns clean, but it doesn't have the same amount of energy as gasoline, which is both good and bad.  The good news is that it burns more efficiently and less fuel is wasted in heat and emissions.  But, because it has less energy, you also have to open the jets on your carb (I told you it was a while back!) about 40% to get to the right air fuel mixture for ethanol.  Therefore the miles per gallon go down.  You also lose some power and to get it back you have to raise the compression to something like 10:1.

So I think it could be done, but it would probably be easier to install a modern electronic fuel injection that would give you the right mixture and raise the compression.

Pete S.

[n/a]

Raymond,

I'm just back from Rio and was very interested during my short time there with the Ethanol versus Gasoline (petrol) debate. Seems that 85% of new cars in Brazil are flex - i.e. can burn both. Ethanol is 20% less efficient (but the cars don't seem to run any slower). Ethanol production is driven by Petrobras and is subject to the sugar cane harvest. Therefore, the price rises and falls much like oil but is seasonal. When Ethanol is 20% than petrol, everyone starts buying the ethanol.

Regards
Paul

Regards, Paulo

[66andBlue]

I couldn't resist .. E85 or fossil fuel?
In any case, a Pagoda will NEVER be a Dinosaur  
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Alfred
1966 blue 230SL automatic