Potential new owner of a 64 230

[Rob London]

Hi there,

I have been lucky enough to drive a few w113 over the years and the 230 is my favourite. I saw a 230 go for £30k two years ago and the same cars has just sold for £50k! It was nice but not perfect for the money. I also see that even the manuals are going for £65k+ now.

I have been looking for something to restore as although I think I would end up spending similar money but I would know it was done correctly and be a life long car.

I have found a 64 in Dubin. http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C402283

See more photos on my link. I am flying out to Dublin tomorrow to see it. I have seen all the comments about how much will this and that cost and I am not going to ask as I know it is a loaded question and very difficult to answer. The car is complete but the body is bad. It seems to be mostly around the shock mounts. In one of the pictures you can see the support panel but not the actual shock mount is rusted through. £15k is the ballpark for the car. It seems to be around 42k miles from the paperwork I have been sent.

I am actually looking for some constructive discouragement to be honest as I think it may be a money pit.

I have space in a workshop with a body shop next door and would plan to do as much of the unskilled work myself as possible with people on hand to offer advice as needed and then do the more complicated jobs that I cannot do. Mechanically minded with some light bike restoration and lots of enthusiasm. I know this is going to be £10ks to do but I would just like some thoughts on values really. I don't want to spend more restoring it than I would be able to get in a resale value in future. I would feel better starting such a project again with some thoughts on the last few years of increase in values.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/90543260@N00/sets/72157634484398650/

From looking back I can see vague questions have been asked before about restoring and I hope not to be flamed!

[Larry & Norma]

Wow that is a real potential money pit, even the seats are not original I think.
If the rust you can see is that bad what about the rust you can't see
Perhaps more experienced restorers will chime in.

[stickandrudderman]

Never, ever get involved in restoring one of these cars if the cost of the restoration needs to be offset by it's finished value. It ain't gonna happen.

[georgem]

Don`t forget to pack a 10ft barge pole for your trip - that's the only way you should touch - and even then be careful. Or, to put it another way....................what Stick said.

[Rob London]

Thanks guys. Head and heart and all that. I do appreciate your thoughts and it is what I thought you would say.

Would it matter what price I got it for? £12k?

I think I should just buy a finished one even if they are £50k+!!!

R

[kampala]

Wow ... in my opinion this is way way way past it's shelf life .. a little rust usually means a lot of hidden rust ... but this one is a LOT of rust everywhere ... I would not worry about what's hidden, there is enough not hidden.  Scary.

You might be excited by the prospect of a total restoration ... I get that ... bringing something back to life ...   At 12K it's still not even close.

Only my opinion,  but that's what you are asking for ... and I am new in the pagoda scene, but not new in common sense ...

Miss your flight ...

[badali]

It looks like a parts car to me but the price is high at that...

[Markbhai]

You don't need to pay anywhere near £50k.

I got my 67 230SL for £19k three years ago and it is a very reasonable car which is winning competitions. At the time I was looking and finding lots of half decent ones in the mid twenty k range which would be rolling restorations.

Try this... http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C402785
Or maybe this?  http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C312062

The point is, they are available at a reasonable price if you are willing to wait.

My advice...Go to Ireland, but don't take your money, have a look and learn about what NOT to buy, someone once told me don't buy the first one you see.

Mark.

[Neil Thompson]

It's been said on this forum many times to spend as much as you can afford when buying a Pagoda, a dog will always be a dog unless you are very able to do the restoration yourself. Specialist labour in the uk will probably be a minimum of £50 per hour to in excess of £100, that's just one hour - these things can take years to restore. Parts prices have escalated too - if you can source them. It is true that the cars have increased in value too but these things, like any investment, can peak and reduce in value at any time, lets face it, I bet most members/pagoda owners on this forum think their cars are over valued.

Just my opinion

Neil

Ps was offered this car, not for me but worth a look perhaps? http://www.somerleycars.co.uk/details.php?id=1043

[stickandrudderman]

Three years ago was a very different market. You're going to have to get extremely lucky to find a decent one for less than 30K today.
I did a spread sheet recently to try and define the predictable cost of a restoration starting from a baseline nowhere near as bad as the car linked above and it came to £87000.
That would get you a top-end, really well sorted car but if you really wanted to address every last detail you'd be looking at over 100K.

[Rob London]

Thank you everyone for your comments. I woke up and it was not a good dream! I have been following the forum for ages and lots of interesting reading.

I am going to keep looking and take everyone's advice to buy the best I can rather than buy cheap and restore. I really want a RHD auto. I will keep searching but expect to pay more. I do like that RHD manual expect for the fact it is a manual.

http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C337282

I just don't understand how some can be £35k and then other £90k.

[georgem]

Rob,

Good decision. Mechanical, body and interior - the three pillars of a restoration. Mechanical and interior are relatively cheap to do but the body is really the financial black hole; and its so important because that's what everyone makes a decision on about the value of a car - panel fit and contours- there are no cheap alternatives to get a worthwhile result. The motor can be tired, no one but you will know, the interior can be a bit off but it will be forgiven BUT an eye will instantly pick out a poorly fitting door, swage lines that don`t line up and a bonnet with uneven gaps and a grill that is crooked.  So the moral to this little tale is, body first, interior second and  mechanicals a distant second and third.

Good hunting

[kampala]

Rob,

6 months a ago a RHD was avail in sweden ... partially restored.   Not sure if still avail. 


http://www.sl113.org/forums/index.php?topic=16477.msg122794#msg122794

[Paul99]

I hear what you say about prices. But I think as its the 50th pagoda year some people mainly dealers are taking the micheal. I also know what you mean about why is one car 30k and another 60k.

I was lucky to find a one lady owner from new 66 230 auto power white for 16k two years ago.  It looked rough because it had spent its whole life in Chelsea London so lots of dings and dents. Once you get to know these cars you find out where the issues are and where the cost is.  I found that mine had zero rust and a new full floor installed by mb about six years ago.  The floors and rear end rust are a real issue. 

Just watch out for a complete car if possible. Some parts like chrome and the front star are eye watering expensive.  I have just heard that the pagoda bonnet badge is now around £125. Just for a badge! 

Not sure what mine is worth, but not interested in selling its such a lovely car to drive. You will love it once you get one. Good luck,