Three Piston Caliper? 1964 230SL

[ssamuelson]

Hey guys,

I am having problems with my 1964 230SL; sticking brake problem.     I have already changed lines but still stick.     My next task was to replace the Calipers.    I removed one of the calipers and realized that it is a three piston caliper, two smaller pistons outboard and one large one inboard. 

I'm looking to replace both front Calipers, but there are a lot of options and companies offering replacements, I am having difficulties determining which is the correct one to purchase/install.        I noticed some previous contributors recommended RockAuto and I have a couple options:   Rockauto 3 piston or should I just go with a couple of the Rockauto calipers regardless of piston number?

Below is a link to a couple photos of the Front Right Caliper, Is this the Original Caliper?

http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/ssamuelson/library/Mercedes%20230SL%20%201964?sort=3&page=1

Thanks,
Steve S

[114015]

Steve,

Yes, three piston calipers (Girling) are correct for a 1964 230 SL.
Only later on (from 1966 onwards (?)) 2-piston calipers (ATE) were used, which are still available today.

The 3-piston calipers can be overhauled but parts are rare and expensive.
Depensds on what you want. But it _is_ possible.

Good luck,

Achim

[ssamuelson]

Achim,

Thanks for the info on three piston calipers for front brakes.     I am looking at RockAuto catalog and they offer Centric, Arnley and Remy calipers for the 230SL.    I have looked at another on-line company, German Star and they also sell calipers but no mention of the manufacturer.      Are you familiar with these companies?    Any recommendations on where and what calipersnto purchase?

Thanks
SS

[scoot]

I had a very similar caliper on the front of my W111 sedan and replaced with ATE.  FWIW.

[ctaylor738]

You can have them rebuilt if you want to stay authentic.  One place I have had good results with is White Post Restorations in White Post VA.

Cheers,

[scoot]

You can have them rebuilt if you want to stay authentic.  One place I have had good results with is White Post Restorations in White Post VA.

True, but it kind of depends on what your goal is. If you want an easy solution, buy ATE and you will always be able to get parts, and you can keep the Girling for the next owner if they want the original...   You are fortunate in that your calipers feed through the side.  Mine fed through the top so I had to fabricate a correct rigid brake line to go from the hose to the caliper...

[ctaylor738]

Never could resist a dive into the EPC.

Parts for the 3-pistion calipers may be available.  Achim was correct about the parts being expensive.  All prices list, but you could probably get 20% off from the Classic Center or one of the online dealers.

000 421 33 83 piston outside quantity 4 (needed) $99
000 421 34 83 piston inside quantity 2 (needed) $140
000 586 86 42 repair kit calipers, make Girling quantity 1 (needed) $147

So for a mere $683 in parts (list), you could rebuild the Girlings with Mercedes parts.

Cheers,

CT

[vande17941]

RockAuto has the Pistons and seals for super cheap.  I have a set of the ATE and the Girling for my 66 230...absolutely zero braking difference even at the limit.

[Ron500E]

Going through the same situation so I called White Post, a place that I have done business with and highly recommend.
Rebuild Prices as follows:
Girling 3 Piston Calipers $240 each.
Rear Cylinders $85 each.
Master Cylinder $225.
Rear Shoes Relined $160. ($40. Each)

All, except shoes, with lifetime warranty.
Add some pads and new genuine Mercedes hoses and about $1200. or so you have a brand new braking system.
A reasonable amount of money but cheap insurance IMHO considering the value of your car and your life. Not to mention mine if you're behind me....

Kind Regards,

Ron

[Tomnistuff]

Even when buying Girling calipers, one needs to be careful.  Apparently there were lots of Girling three-piston calipers with very minor differences in the castings.  Example, my 1969 Ferrari 365GT 2+2 had the same (apparently) calipers.  I've even seen them without the "G" on the single piston side casting.

My replacements fit perfectly, "HOWEVER", a tiny casting difference forced me to modify the disc backing plate on one of the front hubs.  Additionally, perhaps due to rebuild "machining", I found that with new everything, rotors, calipers and pads, althought the measurements looked right, they were tight when newly assembled.  I had to manually turn them for a couple of hundred revolutions before I felt comfortable that they will loosen up quickly when I drive it and apply the brakes a few times.  At least, the left and the right are the same.

If I could do it over again, I would have had my old ones rebuilt instead of buying rebuilt ones.

At my age, I have finally concluded that not all my questions will get answered.  Just be careful.

Tom Kizer

[Ulf]

Just came across these reconditioned Girlings: http://www.ebay.de/itm/Mercedes-W113-Girling-3Kolben-Sattel-Generaluberholt-Paar-inkl-Kolben-Neu-/271813145772?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_77&hash=item3f495374ac

:-)

[scoot]

Be mindful of whether the brake line on your caliper enters the TOP or the SIDE.  It makes a difference when you try to swap in parts.  Girling can be either way.  ATE is side.

[Tomnistuff]

I just checked one of my favorite sources.  Rock Auto has three piston Girling Rebuilt Calipers for $65 ea with a $56 core charge each (for a 1966 230SL).  I didn't check any others but I think for the Pagoda, all the Girlings are pretty close to the same.
Tom Kizer

[Tomnistuff]

According to Rock Auto, they also have the same Caliper listed for the 1964 230SL and that is in CANADIAN dollars which are only about 80 percent of U.S. Dollars.
Tom Kizer

[rwmastel]

Tom,

I have a 1966 230SL from Italy also!  My vin ends in 018381, how about yours?

I have 3-piston Girlings on my 230SL.  One of the earliest things I did with the car, maybe in 2001?, was rebuild the calipers.  The cylinder bores were slightly pitted as were the pistons.  I ignored the pitting in the cylinders because I didn't believe the rubber seal around the lip of the piston would overlap any of the pits.  I had new pistons made at a machine shop out of aluminum, using the originals as a template because correct originals were so expensive.  New rubber parts and I was done.  They've worked well for years!  Its a DYI job for even a beginner, given patients and help from fellow members here.

Search only found 4 references to Girling, and 2 are mine!
http://www.sl113.org/forums/index.php?topic=1418.0
http://www.sl113.org/forums/index.php?topic=1939.0
http://www.sl113.org/forums/index.php?topic=5537.0
http://www.sl113.org/forums/index.php?topic=6613.0

[tel76]

Not a good idea to fit new parts into pitted calliper bodies.
There are companies who fit SS inserts into the alloy body very satisfactorily and it is not expensive.
But do not tell them they are fitted to a Pagoda.

[rwmastel]

Sorry, time had gotten the best of my memory.  It was stainless steel, not aluminum, that the parts were crafted from.

[mdsalemi]

I'm happy to have ATE...rebuilding and or exchange is not expensive. $40 each when I had it done, now it's a bit more, but still way less than $100 each and for that you get back something indistinguishable from new. My local ATE supplier, All Euro, stocks the remanufactured from ATE and since these are not serial numbered items, an exchange is in order when needed...