What engine this W113?

[Zazozazo]

Good evening all
Can anyone tell me what engine is this of the W113 model ?
Does the number between spark plugs 5 & 6 mean anything ?
Thank you 

[Pawel66]

This is a very good looking engine.

Go to Technical Manual, Engine, Engine numbers - it is all there.

[Zazozazo]

I did , but couldn't find any with this stamp on

[Pawel66]

the 250 is the head marking: https://www.sl113.org/wiki/Engine/CylinderHead

Check the engine number - this is the most important number. Head might have been replaced.

[SEB]

Pawel! For me it looks like the engine M127 from the 230SL Pagoda early version. Look at the Oil bar, fuel injection pump supply and the cooling water tank.

[Pawel66]

Yes it does! In our Tech Manual the table says nothing about head cast markings (no markings?) but it says 129 had the head with 250. This head has the 250 marking...

[SEB]

Pawel! Please notice, that the M129 Cylider head fit to the M127. If you look at the Oil bar and the R11 fuel injection pump- for me is the 230SL engine in the early version - so up to 1965. After the 230SL overtook many elements from the modern 250SE/SL engine- other oil pan, oil bar etc. And finally is not so easy to get the 230 cylinder head.

[Pawel66]

Yes, that is why i said the head might have been replaced.

Zazozazo was after determining "matching numbers" of the car. The engine looks correct with replaced head, which to me is not important.

This is why i am saying to Zazozazo to check the engine number.

[SEB]

I think, that the best, what Zazozazo can do is to hire an advisor, somebody who know the Pagoda very well. So far all cars what he presented looks quite good, with some minor defects in some cases.  So in the end as allways is the matter of price/quality ratio. Ii is my opinion.

[Zazozazo]

Here she is matching with datacard :-)

[SEB]

So as I said it is a 230SL with the M127 engine like in the data card with the form the M129 engine- 250 Cylinder head. In my opinion is a hybrid from two engines?

[Pawel66]

So it looks. But Zazozazo would need to check the engine number on the. Block and in the datacard to confirm.

That is given our table with head markings is correct there, but why would it not be? Highly unlikely 127 head would carry 250 marking, i think.

[SEB]

Pawel! I have seen already few in this way made 230 SL engines.
Why? There are at least two reasons.
First is the availability of the 230SL cylinder head and his high price- if you can get it with the accent to if- you have to pay 4.500 Euro.
Second the 250 engine is the development of the 230 engine and the head fit to the 230 engine. But the interesting thing is  you have 10 times more parts on the market for the M129 engines and as result you have to pay for such head  overhauled on the market about 1.000 Euro.
The third reason is more technical, so I will not write about this.

[mdsalemi]

So far Zazozaso is presenting a number of cars with questions about matching numbers, like trying to fit a puzzle together. While we have seen, as others have said, nice examples, the focus has been solely on numbers.

My opinion is that one thing not presented is--how does it run?

If you have a mismatch of head and engine, or even not the same engine as delivered in the car as new, these should be all secondary to how well the car is fit together and how it runs. You are not going to tell this from photos, and unless there's a hidden trove of Pagodas populating the island of Malta, someone may have to travel...

I'd rather have a mismatched 230 or 250 then one perfectly matched that runs poorly...for you don't know what it may take to make it run better, but in a well running (and thus well sorted) car someone had a clue as to what they might have been doing.

[Pawel66]

I am with you on this. I would add rust to the equasion,

But if Zazozazo asks - just trying to answer.

[Zazozazo]

Rust is completely eradicated in the nut and bolt restoration Pagodas
Trying to go for the best possible

[Pawel66]

Well, I would not bet on it . Be careful.