Newbie Soliciting feedback on plans

[NewToW113]

Looking forward to interacting with the group as a new member. I'm ready to plan my winter projects and the list is below, feedback is welcome, Im sure Im missing something.

My car is a relatively rust free Euro 67 230SL 4 speed.  Definitely a ok-maintained driver imported from France in the 70s, lived its life in the US in DE with one owner since imported.  Originally Mercedes blue/ black mb-tex interior, now Dupont gold with olive top and hub cap centers (repaint back to original may be a part of future plans).   As the PO aged he drove it less, and for the past 2 years it has been less active, parked in a climate controlled garage, started once a week and oil changed 2x year.

My most immediate punch list is:

1) replace or rebuild water pump (original 2 bolt serviceable unit) as it is mildly leaking from the shaft when running
2) address a misfire/ fuel issue evident at 2500-3000 rpm
- replace points with elect ignition
- check fuel pressure/replace injectors
- new plugs
3)  PO had his mechanic wire a toggle switch to activate CSV, bypassing the CS relay and TTS.  Will return this to original (looks like he ran new wires to solenoid so harness appears to be intact
4) PO had his mechanic wire a start button b/c the ignition switch stopped activating starter.  Will return this to original/ replace or repair ignition switch
5) replace US spec headlights with Euro (PO did this in 70's)
6) troubleshoot heat blower fan/ mixer controls
7) normal break check/ chassis lube

My goal is to create a reliable dry weather driver not a restoration, but I want to keep it as original as possible.  If anyone has comments on my plans, or additional suggestions, please let me know!
Thanks

[Cees Klumper]

Good plans. My only comments are that you may want to also:

- change the coolant and brake fluids, if you are not certain that has been done in the recent past (say 2-3 years)

- check the dates on the tires. Can be marked on the inside of the tires. If older than say 10 years, replace

- as you are underneath the car, check for obvious issues in the suspension, driveshaft couplings, exhaust system and so forth. Double check for rust everywhere and address before it worsens.

I got a new ignition switch (but that was for a 280SL) a few years ago for a reasonable EUR 70 or so, from Germany, as my switch failed the same way it sounds like yours has. Not a huge job to put in as I recall.

[Bonnyboy]

Welcome to the forum.  I didn't see if you are a full member but become one. 

I see your list and think that it looks reasonable.   I would find out why some of the work was done before replacing items. 

Items 1 and 2 - go for it - needs to be done but figure out why its missing first and then go electronic ignition after.  You should try cleaning the injectors before replacing them - they may be ok.  You may want to flush the fuel tank and fuel line / filters just to be on the safe side - measure the flow of the fuel going back onto the fuel tank.

Items 3 and 4 - find out why this was needed  - a new ignition switch may solve some of those problems

Items 5 - yes - euro lights look great

Item 6 - take it easy and be careful - the levers may break.  lube the cables and make sure the flaps open

Item 7 - make sure all of your grease nipples actually work - sometime they don't and if they don't the item they lube may need work - carefully go through the suspension to make sure no extra movement, missing parts .

I would suggest looking at engine and transmission mounts as well - "relatively' easy to replace.  Check the condition of the shocks and always be on  the look out for rust.   Wheel bearings are often overlooked.  Flush the brake system and replace the brake lines if they are older.

These cars can be driven very hard (watch the old videos)  so you want everything to be up to snuff suspension/brakes wise for the safety of you and anyone on the road.   


 

[NewToW113]

Can you elaborate on:

"Items 1 and 2 - go for it - needs to be done but figure out why its missing first and then go electronic ignition after.  You should try cleaning the injectors before replacing them - they may be ok.  You may want to flush the fuel tank and fuel line / filters just to be on the safe side - measure the flow of the fuel going back onto the fuel tank."

Its weird to me that the issue only shows up in the 2500-3000 RPM range.   because its so focused, does it point to some issue that could be more specific?  If I had bad pressure, I would think the higher the engine revs the more the issue would present itself?

[mnahon]

I had a similar issue at one point on my car (missing at higher revs) that got resolved after doing the 'linkage tour'  that you can find in the technical manual. That's one exercise you can do at zero cost and that could sort out some issues.

It's hard to say whether the cause of your problem is fuel or spark; but you're right that most of those problems would continue to get worse at higher revs.

[Shvegel]

Before touching anything on the fuel injection I would either replace the points or more likely install some form of electronic ignition.  You are correct in your diagnosis that it would be odd to have a pressure issue in that narrow band of RPM.  My rule of thumb is that if it feels like you are moving the throttle pedal when it is missing it is a fuel issue and if it is a hard staccato feeling it is an ignition issue.

[mdsalemi]

Welcome to the group. Having done many of the things you are proposing over a long period of time, here's my take on some of it:

1) replace or rebuild water pump (original 2 bolt serviceable unit) as it is mildly leaking from the shaft when running

These pumps tend to leak at the bearings, from sitting a while while the car isn't used. Few of our cars are used daily and this will be an issue. Probably easier to just replace it. BUT: while you are at it, since removing it can be a royal PIA, you may consider re-coring the radiator (if it has not been), and repainting/refinishing some of the parts you need to remove in order to get the water pump out. Now, I have a 280SL, USA version, but at the time I did the water pump, I had the radiator recored, changed all the radiator hoses, belts, and refinished the cowl, and air cleaner housing.

2) address a misfire/ fuel issue evident at 2500-3000 rpm

You've got some solid advice from others there. Linkage tour is one. Also before you consider adding any kind of electronic ignition, you want to ensure your distributor isn't showing signs of wear.  Check all the wires and connections, points, etc. If you don't get the ignition correct before you put an electronic in, you may not fix any issues--just mask them.

3)  PO had his mechanic wire a toggle switch to activate CSV, bypassing the CS relay and TTS.  Will return this to original (looks like he ran new wires to solenoid so harness appears to be intact

Wondering on this, if the PO was trying to put a band aid on another issue?

4) PO had his mechanic wire a start button b/c the ignition switch stopped activating starter.  Will return this to original/ replace or repair ignition switch

Yeah, replacement of the ignition switch, or repair is in serious order there...and that "fix" probably would tell me that #3 above is also a "fix".

5) replace US spec headlights with Euro (PO did this in 70's)

The PO did this in the 70s probably to get the car to pass inspection or legitimized for the USA. If you already have the parts, fine--it's a few hours work one afternoon. If not, it's a pretty costly change, so best (IMHO) to spend the money on sorting out runnability first. If it's not running right, and you have all these wacky fixes like the ignition switch bypass, you probably won't be driving much at night, so move that down the list unless you need quick gratification. I keep wanting brighter and better lights on my USA spec car until I catch myself with the fact that I don't drive at night if I can help it, and not in the rain either.

6) troubleshoot heat blower fan/ mixer controls

Hope your back is in good shape. It's a bear getting underneath where all this stuff is. Blower motors are available and you may be able to have yours repaired if that's the issue.

7) normal brake check/ chassis lube

You may be able to send the brake calipers out for a relatively inexpensive rebuild; check with a local foreign auto parts store. Change all the hoses unless you know they are new. If you want to go you need to stop!

Unless you have evidence to the contrary, assume all the hoses and belts may need a change, and certainly all the fluids do.

[GM]

The 4 most dangerous words in a car refurb or home remodel: "while you're at it"

[mdsalemi]

The 4 most dangerous words in a car refurb or home remodel: "while you're at it"

One sentence I rarely ever say any longer in either car or home refurb (for which I have learned from experience)…”I should have done — when I had the opportunity”  LOL

In one alarming case with my car during the restoration, we had basically finished all the body work, done the painting, received the engine back from Metric, and were nearly 2 years into the process...and the restorer says to me, "what do you want to do about the transmission?" My initial thought--the best one--was to send it out for a rebuild. But by this time, I was getting anxious for completion, the restorer said it probably is OK, and we put the original transmission back in.

It leaked, and didn't shift well.

So, some short months after the restoration, off it went to a local independent, who serviced and changed some seals. Unfortunately he may have NOT tightened the flex disk, or neglected to change it, or something along those lines...since it let loose entering a highway, destroying the transmission, the case of the transmission, and the drive shaft. One costly lesson.

If it needs to be refurbished or replaced, do it. If you THINK it needs refurbishment or replacement, that means it does too. Sometimes lessons are learned the hard way.

[NewToW113]

Thanks everyone for your feedback especially mdsalemi....

Im already at an impass with the water pump, Im sure you all know more than I.  My pump seems to have a pulley and fan spacer built in as a unit to the oil-type maintenance type pump.  The pulley is threaded (fan bolts all the way through to the back of the pulley) and seems to be a part if the unit, as does the aluminum fan spacer.  Have you seen this before?  the impeller is stamped MB, and by the condition Im assuming it is the original pump.  Seems like I'll need to go hunt for a new pulley and spacer to fit to my new pump...

[mdsalemi]

That spacer is merely that: an aluminum spacer. It is used with the short-body water pump.

If you go online to our usual gang of suspects for parts, you will see that there are both short body and long body water pumps available. The short body requires long bolts and the spacer. The long body requires shorter bolts and no spacer.

There is a school of thought, not scientifically proven, but empirically suggested, that the long body water pump's bearings will have less load and thus last longer. So I took this advice, regardless, and when I changed my short body pump a few years back, I replaced it with the long body. I needed to get new shorter screws.

There was no need for any changes to the pulley on mine. Same pulley, different water pump, no spacer, shorter bolts.

I believe I used a Laso branded pump. The other brand available to me at the time was a Graf. I did not consider an OEM MB branded item as the price was astronomically higher. One thing I did do, however, is buy (I think it was like $5 or so) an MB OEM water pump gasket. The aftermarket pumps generally come with a gasket, but their gaskets are a bit of a joke. The MB gasket is thick and robust.

[NewToW113]

That spacer is merely that: an aluminum spacer. It is used with the short-body water pump.

If you go online to our usual gang of suspects for parts, you will see that there are both short body and long body water pumps available. The short body requires long bolts and the spacer. The long body requires shorter bolts and no spacer.

There is a school of thought, not scientifically proven, but empirically suggested, that the long body water pump's bearings will have less load and thus last longer. So I took this advice, regardless, and when I changed my short body pump a few years back, I replaced it with the long body. I needed to get new shorter screws.

There was no need for any changes to the pulley on mine. Same pulley, different water pump, no spacer, shorter bolts.

I believe I used a Laso branded pump. The other brand available to me at the time was a Graf. I did not consider an OEM MB branded item as the price was astronomically higher. One thing I did do, however, is buy (I think it was like $5 or so) an MB OEM water pump gasket. The aftermarket pumps generally come with a gasket, but their gaskets are a bit of a joke. The MB gasket is thick and robust.

The prob is I can not remove the spacer or the pulley from the water pump, they seem to be one unit.  Is that possible? 

Thanks for the advice on the gasket.  I thought the one I have looked thin. 

[mdsalemi]

The prob is I can not remove the spacer or the pulley from the water pump, they seem to be one unit.

Anything is possible of course, but if it’s original equipment the pulley, the spacer, and the water pump are all separate items. You may need to takeoff the water pump with the pulley and spacer attached, bring it to a bench and use a little heat and force to separate them.

[NewToW113]

we wlil see..weird thing is that the pulley is threaded so the long bolts actually thread to the pulley not the pump. I'll see if I can separate it and will send pics