Rear Fog Light

[MikeSimon]

My car had a rear fog light from the factory. I remember taking it off for some reason 35 or so years ago. Do not know what happened with it. What did these things look like originally? Square or rectangular? Did they have a chrome frame around the lens or were they rimless?

[WRe]

Hi,
Here you can find some info: https://www.pagodentreff.de/diskussionsforum/threads/original-position-nebelschlussleuchte.16925/.
...WRe

[John Betsch - "SADIE"]

just a quick shot of my rear fog light if it helps in your quest

jb

[Pawel66]

There is quite a lot about rear fog lamp in the Technical Manual: https://www.sl113.org/wiki/Electrical/Foglights

That includes a picture as well. Another picture is in the option Codes list.

If you kept the bumper you had in your car, you should have two mounting holes in it in the proper distance from the center of the car.

Something like this: https://www.ebay.de/itm/386809927371?itmmeta=01HRKVK0K8S7ZH7GDXRSSM7236&hash=item5a0fab16cb:g:GysAAOSwfO1l2iVI&itmprp=enc%3AAQAIAAABADOyyyw5ZhtZm6MnJ24bzvxscRr0v7fxY2CJZLs7mB4mh7O2AETjiZw%2FZ2zf5sS345mIG2JMTlM20%2FHj0yBQ3pEjsTPADfdzBl19rvqhT7ZPiKRZiIAODDfXenfPMn6EC2wCXdSd3dCin4zDTK05HsVHTms1LJRfoXzZOQl1T9gegYuLz1vNuS2jbgyyGGwWhhXOyysDD03yrj9W4K%2Bu8MnMw5HG0dr30rSS4OuVaIgCwkGtzKbqGUzKbK2l3PwUO9dtyT%2BFQdD6--gaFuAAt4btsJxXD%2B6GoM4XG71PiaB4LCU9NQ8ZSYCu6z5Esh%2FC50a%2FaU5lDI0ZyXYYQYQW3Wo%3D%7Ctkp%3ABFBM2onM-8Rj

[Jordan]

I believe all original bumpers have the holes in them for the fog lights.  My car did not come with a fog light but there is a hole in the underside of both rear bumpers in the same spot as indicated on John's photo.

[Pawel66]

I am not sure if the fog lamp location on John's photo is correct. There is a fairly large hole in the bumper near the location of the fog lamp in John's photo, but it is just a drain hole. This one, I am sure, is present in all bumpers.

The distance of the fog lamp from the car center is specified and part of the instructions in technical Manual. The lamp in proper location is shown on the picture there.

There are two holes in a bumper, about 5-6mm diameter, about 10-15mm apart more towards the outer part of the bumper, proper distance from the car center - these are for factory fog lamp bracket, held by 2 screws. They may not be present on all bumpers, I am not sure.

On the picture - location that is most likely correct.

[BobH]

As far as i know the rear fog light factory option was only available from 1968, so John's car may have been a dealer fitted accessory, perhaps there was no defined position for the location at that time?

[Pawel66]

As far as i know the rear fog light factory option was only available from 1968, so John's car may have been a dealer fitted accessory, perhaps there was no defined position for the location at that time?

Yes, could be, or they just used the drain hole for installation.

My remarks were referring to the factory installation.

I looked again at the Technical Manual information - I see that the distance specification is not there. I am digging to find it... and I could not. It was an MB workshop instruction, similar to the one we have in Technical Manual, but providing this dimension and with slightly different drawing. Maybe the one we have is for subsequent installation and it is using the drain hole as anchor point? I do not know.

I am attaching two poor pictures of the lamp on my car with fabricated bracket.

The distance between the center of trunk lock and the center of the lamp is ca 560mm.

In the meantime, another data point for Mike on how this lamp looked like: https://www.sl113.org/forums/index.php?topic=23779.msg170182#msg170182

[John Betsch - "SADIE"]

Jordan, there are two holes in both bumpers (basically at each end)  My fog llght is not mounted using that hole.

Bob H: From the wiring and mounted switching, I agree that my fog light is not a manufacturer installed item.  I know that the TUV mandated first aid kits and warning triangles sometime in the '60's.  Maybe a Germany member can chime in, or may know,  if this might also have been a mandated item in the '60's.  Just a thought.

JB

[WRe]

Hi, following rules for Germany

- Since January 1966, first aid kits have been mandatory in motor vehicles.
- Since May 1, 1968, cars and trucks have had to carry a warning triangle.
- From January 1, 1974 mandatory installation of seat belts in new cars.
  The retrofitting of seat belts in older cars first registered after April 1, 1970 was mandatory on January 1, 1976 with a
  two-year transition period.
  The requirement to wear seatbelts in the front seats came into force in 1976.
- The rear fog light became mandatory for cars from 1991 onwards.

...WRe

[John Betsch - "SADIE"]

This is terrific information, appreciated.  I purchased my Pagoda in 1988 (with its fog/"Autobahn" light installed), so it appears the Germany owner was ahead of mandated requirements. 

What a great forum, every day more and more is learned about our cars

jb

[MikeSimon]

Hi, following rules for Germany

 
  The retrofitting of seat belts in older cars first registered after April 1, 1970 was mandatory on January 1, 1976 with a
  two-year transition period.
  The requirement to wear seatbelts in the front seats came into force in 1976.
 
...WRe

I can't really argue about that, BUT: I bought my 1971 model 280SL in 1982 in Germany and drove it there until I brought it to the US with me in 1988.
The car did not have seat belts from the factory and still does not have any.

The car was first registered on December 6, 1970 - after April 1, 1970
I went through several TUV inspections, never did I have an issue with not having seat belts.
Never was i stopped by the police for a violation of not wearing seatbelts.

[WRe]

Hi,
this regulation also irritated me because my vehicle was first registered in January 1971 and was not delivered or equipped with any seat belts. I checked this regulation again and found the following.

"Vehicles that came into circulation for the first time between April 1, 1970 and December 31, 1973 only require seat belts if they were equipped with belt attachment points for the front seats."

Now you can ask yourself whether this has been the case with our vehicles since 1970. It would be suitable for static belts but not for automatic three-point belts.
What I think would also be important to clarify is the question of what it legally means that a vehicle came into circulation. Does this mean the initial registration of an individual car or the general registration of the vehicle type W113?
...WRe

[rwmastel]

"Vehicles that came into circulation for the first time between April 1, 1970 and December 31, 1973 only require seat belts if they were equipped with belt attachment points for the front seats."

I would think this means - when the first 280SL was made available to the public.  Not specifically an individual person's car.

[MikeSimon]

"Vehicles that came into circulation for the first time between April 1, 1970 and December 31, 1973 only require seat belts if they were equipped with belt attachment points for the front seats."

...WRe

Again, it would apply to the W113. My car has attachment points for seat belts.

[MikeSimon]

Now you can ask yourself whether this has been the case with our vehicles since 1970. It would be suitable for static belts but not for automatic three-point belts.
What I think would also be important to clarify is the question of what it legally means that a vehicle came into circulation. Does this mean the initial registration of an individual car or the general registration of the vehicle type W113?
...WRe

Automatic or static belts is irrelevant. The mounting points are for both. The mounting of the spool for retracting belts is an issue, but Mercedes Benz published a service bulleting for the installation of the automatic belts.
And to clarify the real meaning of "came into circulation" one would have to have the original German text. My guess is, it means first individual registration.

[WRe]

Hi,
I researched again for Germany: However, seat belts have only had to be installed in new cars since 1974, and only in the back seat since 1979. Vehicles that were registered between April 1970 and the end of 1973 only require seat belts if the seats are equipped with belt fastening points are. Conversely, classic cars that were first registered before April 1970 do not have to be retrofitted with seat belts. Which in turn means that they should have been installed in such vehicles from 04/70.
Today "Oldtimer" means classic cars older than 30 years don't need seat belts.
...WRe

[rwmastel]

Hi, following rules for Germany

- Since January 1966, first aid kits have been mandatory in motor vehicles.
- From January 1, 1974 mandatory installation of seat belts in new cars.

I guess it took them 8 years to realize they could reduce the utilization of first aid kits by installing seat belts?

But, I'm not one to talk.  I've still not retrofit my 230SL with seat belts.  I think it comes from growing up on motorcycles and being comfortable unrestrained.

[Jordan]

But, I'm not one to talk.  I've still not retrofit my 230SL with seat belts.  I think it comes from growing up on motorcycles and being comfortable unrestrained.

I was attending a one day safety course many many moons ago and one segment was given by a State Trooper.  I have never forgotten what he said about seat belts.  He told us that in the 25+ years as a State Trooper he had seen hundreds of car accidents, some of them very gruesome.  But he said in all that time the one thing he had never ever seen was a dead body wearing a seat belt.  That really stuck with me.

[rwmastel]

Oh, I know the safety they provide.  I've been in a couple accidents.  The retrofit is on the list.  I just don't know when I'll be doing all the work.

[MikeSimon]

Hi,
I researched again for Germany: However, seat belts have only had to be installed in new cars since 1974, and only in the back seat since 1979. Vehicles that were registered between April 1970 and the end of 1973 only require seat belts if the seats are equipped with belt fastening points are. Conversely, classic cars that were first registered before April 1970 do not have to be retrofitted with seat belts. Which in turn means that they should have been installed in such vehicles from 04/70.
Today "Oldtimer" means classic cars older than 30 years don't need seat belts.
...WRe

It still contradicts what has been going on with my car. According to this, it should have been retrofitted, but it never was and I never had an issue the six years I owned it in Germany

[WRe]

Hi,
a previous owner of my car (01/71) had problems with the police in Spain (late 1990s) because of a lack of seat belts. He has therefore received a confirmation from Mercedes that "equipping his vehicle with seat belts is not mandatory." I still have all the TÜV reports and no one has ever complained about the lack of seat belts.
I was the first owner of the car who retrofitted seat belts in 2009.
...WRe

[MikeSimon]

My car had a rear fog light from the factory. I remember taking it off for some reason 35 or so years ago. Do not know what happened with it. What did these things look like originally? Square or rectangular? Did they have a chrome frame around the lens or were they rimless?

Well, I think I can get any closer to original with this. And as I am not in it to impress the "straw-hat-blue-blazer" crowd. I consider this issue solved!