Newbie Dilema - 250sl opinions/headlights/sidelights/colour

[flyingv]

Hi All

Im from Nottingham in UK and have just purchased the white 250sl (some schmuck put a 280 badge on it) on this site www.beverlyhillscarclub.com/ ......i am on a budget so sorry guys its not the best car out there but i got a really good price from what is advertised.........i would really welcome observations on the following

1. Is it an early or late model.....from reading posts i get the impression people favour the earlys.....

2. Sorry but i really dont like the sidelights or the rear bumper guards and plan to remove these - what about plugging the holes in the bumper? are there aftermarket chrome plugs?? If i remove sidelights how will this affect my ability to indicate - can the rear and front lights (which i intend to change to euro's and repaint) be adapted to blink?

3. What is involved converting to euro spec headlights - forgive my ignorance but what exactly needs to be changed??.... lenses, rear reflector any vendor recommendations?

4. controversial point but.....i like the light ivory 670 with gloss black hardtop look......is it taboo to change from orig colour

5. any general observations from the fotos would be appreciated...

many thx
Dieter 

[Larry & Norma]

Hi there, well the price is cheap enough. The bubbles under the paint would worry me - once you start digging...
There is no chrome trim on the rear quarters (expensive I think) also no spare tyre?
I wish you good luck and lots of enjoyment

[Richard Madison]

Steering wheel looks like it needs replacing or at least a clean up...the bubbles under rear number plate  require cutting and replacing that section of the body...this is one of the common rust collection places...not a really big job but it can grow if not taken care of.

Other bubble spots also should be taken car of to avoid spreading...the softtop cover area needs some paint work...you may decide to repaint but be sure to attack every speck of bubble and rust else the new paint will become old very quickly.

The color can be changed as you wish...some buyers prefer the original color but this will not affect the resale price significantly if the new color is pleasing and the paint is in good condition.

The version is the later version as you can see from the soft pockets on the doors...not sure that owners prefer the "early" version. Most like what they have.

White was the original color of the exterior and the hard top. Two parts (hood bonnet) and soft top compartment cover have numbers showing they are original to this car. It is a left hand drive, auto shift car with miles and fahrenheit instruments.

Will need two Euro light units and two new chrome surrounds...should be an easy plug in. Euro rear lights have turn signals so this should be easy to get working on this car.

Center console needs a piece of carpet on its inside bottom...carpet may need cleaning or replacing....cover over the dash needs work...wood can be refinished...not sure what the grey square is forward of the shift lever...and some kind of stiff tube is peeking in on the right side of the windshield. Ashtray needs a new cover.

Trunk floor looks clean and rust free...has an amplifier and rear speakers...has an electric antenna. There is some later wiring in the engine area, a car alarm and some wires going to the fuse box. Engine is a little dusty but seems complete.

Undercarriage looks relatively good. Windows seem to be original.

Holes from the rear bumper guards can be covered with Chrome plugs. Front guards have already been removed. The sidemarker holes will need a fill-in and paint blend. Yes, the rear fender chrome strip is missing. If the holes cannot be seen, I wouldn't replace the strip as it is expensive and no one (except us) will know they are missing.

Looks like the soft top needs adjusting as the dealer could not get the top fixed in place properly. The ignition ring is loose...might have to bend the tabs for a tighter fit... not sure what the black round thing is to the left of the ignition.

The heater tabs cannot be seen. They may be broken...can be repaired but it is an annoying job. Many  of these issues are discussed in our Technical Manual.

The seats and interior look new (except over the dash). The glove box door does not fit correctly...shows that the door was removed in the past possibly to access the clock or other parts.

The seller should get credit for showing the problem areas...and the price seems fair.

We all hope for no hidden rust and a good running engine.

Richard M, NYC

[Jordan]

Just to add to the comments.  Looks like there is no firewall pad and one of the horns is missing.  Eventually you may want to add the chrome tips to the exhaust and replace the gas cap.  Otherwise it doesn't look bad.  Do you know its history from the dealer?  When was it driven last?  If you have been reading the various threads you will know that the fuel delivery system suffers with long standing cars.  Best of luck.

[thelews]

Late model.

Why do you ask for observations AFTER you buy it, rather than before?

[graphic66]

Looks like someone gave an out of work chimpanzee a job under the hood. What a disaster. The plug wire routing is novel. You really should check all the fluids and filters in this car before going far. I would suspect you got plenty of banana oil in that car from the looks of it. If the price is right and you are handy this car will provide you with many hours of enjoyment. I have an idea the search function here is going to get a workout from you soon. And you, in my opinion have the best model W113, I do hope you can find a 250 insignia for the trunk. I would guess they are pretty rare and expensive, like most parts on these cars. I would also get a quick overhaul of the ignition quick, plugs; non resistor only, and plug wires; solid copper, no graphite. I would guess the chimp mechanic put in all the wrong stuff. The wires coming out from under the fuse box cover are a classic rookie move. You do have a nice model and color combo to start with, you are going to have a lot of fun. Congratulations!

[Peter van Es]

Hey guys,

let's be supportive of flyingv / Dieter...he bought a car with work, because it fits his budget. Let's just be glad that someone else is stepping up to the plate to try and preserve one of these cars...

Let's help him as much as we can, and welcome, Dieter. Discuss your plan, document and photograph what you do, the before and after, and post updates. Keep coming here for your daily dose of support!

Peter

[flyingv]

Late model.

Why do you ask for observations AFTER you buy it, rather than before?

.....i guess i'm kind of impulsive but fair point.....

[flyingv]

Hi there, well the price is cheap enough. The bubbles under the paint would worry me - once you start digging...
There is no chrome trim on the rear quarters (expensive I think) also no spare tyre?
I wish you good luck and lots of enjoyment

....many thx - i appreciate you taking the time to answer - yep bubbles are a bit of a worry but it was a very cheap car and i intend to have a bare metal respray and get rid of any nasties including those damn sidelights! Thx again

[flyingv]

Just to add to the comments.  Looks like there is no firewall pad and one of the horns is missing.  Eventually you may want to add the chrome tips to the exhaust and replace the gas cap.  Otherwise it doesn't look bad.  Do you know its history from the dealer?  When was it driven last?  If you have been reading the various threads you will know that the fuel delivery system suffers with long standing cars.  Best of luck.

Thx very much - appreciate your answer!

[flyingv]

Looks like someone gave an out of work chimpanzee a job under the hood. What a disaster. The plug wire routing is novel. You really should check all the fluids and filters in this car before going far. I would suspect you got plenty of banana oil in that car from the looks of it. If the price is right and you are handy this car will provide you with many hours of enjoyment. I have an idea the search function here is going to get a workout from you soon. And you, in my opinion have the best model W113, I do hope you can find a 250 insignia for the trunk. I would guess they are pretty rare and expensive, like most parts on these cars. I would also get a quick overhaul of the ignition quick, plugs; non resistor only, and plug wires; solid copper, no graphite. I would guess the chimp mechanic put in all the wrong stuff. The wires coming out from under the fuse box cover are a classic rookie move. You do have a nice model and color combo to start with, you are going to have a lot of fun. Congratulations!

oh dear - ........disaster - sounds bad......gulp!....the car was very cheap - i got several thousand off the price.....i intend a full bare metal respray to address the bodywork nasties and to get rid of those damn sidelights.......will get the wiring looked at thx........banana oil??....old oil???........thx for your kind comments however and your advice!

[flyingv]

Hey guys,

let's be supportive of flyingv / Dieter...he bought a car with work, because it fits his budget. Let's just be glad that someone else is stepping up to the plate to try and preserve one of these cars...

Let's help him as much as we can, and welcome, Dieter. Discuss your plan, document and photograph what you do, the before and after, and post updates. Keep coming here for your daily dose of support!

Peter

HI Peter - many thanks for your kind message........i had to drink whiskey after some of the above comments!!

[thelews]

The point of some of the above comments is that you may be underwater trying to fix issues, known and especially unknown, no matter what you paid and that perhaps you ought to consider unloading it while you can walk away and find a better candidate.  On the other hand, maybe you stole it and have a great candidate, can't really tell from pictures.

[graphic66]

My car, when I purchased it was in similar condition, I have an idea what your in for. I got my car very cheap also, I made payments on it in the form of parts and work. If the rust isn't bad you can, with a lot of work, end up with a nice car. Most of the cobbed work, well it looks like all of it can be reversed with time and money. I would start cleaning under the hood and searching out the extra wires and eliminating them. If your going to drive it get your fluids checked/changed. Check the rear diff and transmission, you don't want anything there to fail. Get the filters all changed. If you have some mechanical skills you will do fine. If not it could cost a lot of money. I couldn't even think of owning my car if I had to have someone do the work. Just finding anyone to try to fix these cars can be tough. And remember, try to strive for originality. Look at pictures and research, you will one by one get things back to factory condition. It is rewarding and fun to watch these cars come back to life. Keep searching here, almost everything is covered. Soon you will be on a first name basis with a supplier. But, my opinion is if you don't know where to start, start cleaning. I find more things wrong just by cleaning. Get under that hood with steel wool, magic wadding, engine cleaner and every other type of cleaning stuff you have and scrape off the years of gunk and polish up everything. You will be amazed at the results.

[ctaylor738]

Same here.  My 230 was very cheap, has some rust and paint issues, an incorrect interior, had a blown engine, and the engine compartment was a complete disaster with black spray paint all over, a horrible firewall pad and crazy wiring.  It took some work to get it straightened out but it was very satisfying and the tidy-up of the engine compartment didn't cost very much.  I am on my second summer with the car and having a blast with it.  Many people will come up, ask "What year is it?" and then look it over and say what a nice car it is.  The Pagoda guys frown a lot when they see it. 

You can change the color, but the new combination should be believable.  Ivory with a black top and a red interior would not be believable according to those I have consulted.  My car is ivory with a red interior and I also like a contrasting top and hubcaps.  Everyone thought that ivory/red would be too much red and that ivory is best with just a "touch" of red, i.e. the interior.  So I am leaving it the single color.

All my $.02, and I hope you have as much fun with yours as I have had with mine.

[flyingv]

The point of some of the above comments is that you may be underwater trying to fix issues, known and especially unknown, no matter what you paid and that perhaps you ought to consider unloading it while you can walk away and find a better candidate.  On the other hand, maybe you stole it and have a great candidate, can't really tell from pictures.

thx v much - i really did steal it - i got it for just under $16k.....but i'm committed now and if i have to learn the hard way so be it....in the UK the same car in the same condition would could at least double....

[flyingv]

My car, when I purchased it was in similar condition, I have an idea what your in for. I got my car very cheap also, I made payments on it in the form of parts and work. If the rust isn't bad you can, with a lot of work, end up with a nice car. Most of the cobbed work, well it looks like all of it can be reversed with time and money. I would start cleaning under the hood and searching out the extra wires and eliminating them. If your going to drive it get your fluids checked/changed. Check the rear diff and transmission, you don't want anything there to fail. Get the filters all changed. If you have some mechanical skills you will do fine. If not it could cost a lot of money. I couldn't even think of owning my car if I had to have someone do the work. Just finding anyone to try to fix these cars can be tough. And remember, try to strive for originality. Look at pictures and research, you will one by one get things back to factory condition. It is rewarding and fun to watch these cars come back to life. Keep searching here, almost everything is covered. Soon you will be on a first name basis with a supplier. But, my opinion is if you don't know where to start, start cleaning. I find more things wrong just by cleaning. Get under that hood with steel wool, magic wadding, engine cleaner and every other type of cleaning stuff you have and scrape off the years of gunk and polish up everything. You will be amazed at the results.

Hi again - thx for all the valuable advice - i will bear it in mind...I have a retired MB engineer/enthusiast/collector who will restore/work on the car for $40 bucks an hour...lets hope he's a quick worker!...He's also a master resprayer...and has restored over 20 pagoda's.....im thinking of painting it silver now....not ivory....

[Larry & Norma]

So that's the ace up your sleeve - master painter and restorer
Don't forget to to keep a photographic record and post them here!
The 'before' and 'after' shots should be of great interest to all here.

[johnshenry]

Just thought I'd chime in and say best of luck.   I agree, the "bubbles" would make me very very nervous, but hope for the best.  Sounds like you have some good resources at your disposal.  I bought a '69 280SL last year, same ivory but black interior... and absolutely love it...Keep us posted on the progress...

[Rolland]

About 5 years ago not looking for a Pagoda was having lunch with a buddy and told him I was looking for a fun car, one that was a convertible, and different than what most see on the road.  A week later his Pagoda was registered in my name.  I knew about some of the issues, but enjoyed driving it until about a month ago when the restoration began.  Catch the rust before too much time goes on and hopefully you can find a good person to help you with things you can't do.  I'm a fairly new member to this group, but have felt the passion of others who love these cars.  Most important, have fun with your Pagoda and good luck.  Hopefully our paths cross where down the road.

Rolland

[flyingv]

About 5 years ago not looking for a Pagoda was having lunch with a buddy and told him I was looking for a fun car, one that was a convertible, and different than what most see on the road.  A week later his Pagoda was registered in my name.  I knew about some of the issues, but enjoyed driving it until about a month ago when the restoration began.  Catch the rust before too much time goes on and hopefully you can find a good person to help you with things you can't do.  I'm a fairly new member to this group, but have felt the passion of others who love these cars.  Most important, have fun with your Pagoda and good luck.  Hopefully our paths cross where down the road.

Rolland

Hi Rolland - thx for the message of support - great story too! - the car has issues but it was cheap and I have a retired MB engineer/restorer/enthusiast who has done many Pagodas at a very cheap hourly rate who can do all the work..yep the rust is gonna be sorted immediately - full BM respray..i think im gonna go for DB180 (?) silver which should look nice with the red interior..............

[flyingv]

Just thought I'd chime in and say best of luck.   I agree, the "bubbles" would make me very very nervous, but hope for the best.  Sounds like you have some good resources at your disposal.  I bought a '69 280SL last year, same ivory but black interior... and absolutely love it...Keep us posted on the progress...

HI - thx for your msg - wow ivory/black - v nice combination - classy.......................whoa....rust......yep im a bit nervous too but the car was very cheap....and I have a great guy to restore it.....cheers

[KevinC]

V -

Keep up the enthusiasm! In my opinion, the light Ivory exterior would be great with a red or maroon interior. If you change the hard top to black, don't forget to paint the wheelcover centers black, too. This is how this combination would be presented from the factory. For a compromise, you can do ivory top and bottom with a black soft top.

Best of Luck!

Kevin

PS: Best to sort out safety items first (including potential rusted parts), then mechanics, then cosmetics