Quiz

[lurtch]

Hi All,

 I think I can claim the prize for "worst case of cam scuffing". The ball stud adjuster under this lobe had NO turning resistance. It just kept walking up the thread , thereby  eliminating the any clearance. I guess you could say it was "self adjusting". YUK YUK

Larry in CA

[stickandrudderman]

Benz Dr. has it, well done! As for the comments about the photo quality, perhaps your comments would be more beneficial on a photograper's forum rather than a forum dedicated to the 113.
I make my living out of maintaining Mercedes cars and I certainly do not have any need to pass on my experience FOC.
Once we adjusted the valve clearances the engine performed markedly better.

[mdsalemi]

Benz Dr. has it, well done! As for the comments about the photo quality, perhaps your comments would be more beneficial on a photograper's forum rather than a forum dedicated to the 113.
I make my living out of maintaining Mercedes cars and I certainly do not have any need to pass on my experience FOC.

Stick, you posted a photo measuring 648 x 480, at about 50 k in size!  Compare your photo to Lurtchs.  Only someone like yourself, or Dan Caron, could see enough detail there to pass the quiz.  I clicked on Lurtch's and the photo filled my screen with a lot of enlarged detail.

If you are using visuals, they should be of greater detail, that's all.  If you want help, plenty of people will help.  Including me.  FOC. 

[stickandrudderman]

If you go back to the start of thread you will see that I had difficulty from the outset and not much help was forthcoming from the outset.
Given this I was rather satisfied with myself. I've had no problems uploading pictures on any other forum.
My aim was to illustrate how to spot a problem that might otherwise go unnoticed. This solely for the benefit of others.
I suggest that I was successful in achieving that aim thanks to Dan and his ability to see the detail in the photos that others couldn't.

[DaveB]

Dear Stick,
I enjoyed your quiz and though I could not work it out I learned something.
Of course your photo was perfectly adequate to determine what was wrong.
Dave

[Benz Dr.]

Go back to what I said, '' The picture only has to show you what you need to see. ''

 I had to study it for a while before I saw it but I knew it would be in plain sight. I expected the problem to be clearly shown in the picture even if the picture wasn't clear.

  I have a 190SL that came in a while ago and we installed the engine that was already rebuilt. The owner of the car assured me that it was done by an expert and that it would be OK. So we installed the engine and I took the owners info at face value.

 Well......... the engine made a lot of noise. I removed the valve cover to check the valve timing. Cam was advanced one tooth. OK, that's the problem. We fix that and I expected it to be quiet after this fix. It was still making noise - a kind of knocking sound but diffrent than valve rockers. Similar, but not as sharp. It didn't sound like piston slap or a rod knock. But it was loud.

So we removed the head and I could see where the valves had hit the pistons. Just barely a mark on them. This made no sense at all. When valves hit pistons it's REALLY LOUD! Kind of like two coffee pots hitting each other. OK, the noise wasn't in the head.

I decided to pull the whole engine. After we had it out and the oil pan removed, we removed the pistons. Two connecting rod bearings were scuffed and two were perfect. The pistons were new and undamaged. Piston clearance was perfecft and the pin bushings were tight. All of the rod and main bearings were the correct sizes and the clearance was correct.
 
When we removed the crank shaft what do you think we found? 

 

[thelews]

Go back to what I said, '' The picture only has to show you what you need to see. ''

 I had to study it for a while before I saw it but I knew it would be in plain sight. I expected the problem to be clearly shown in the picture even if the picture wasn't clear.    

I understand what you're saying and agree.  However, you are a professional and to your credit, you saw the problem regardless of the picture quality,even you had to study it.  I'm fairly confident in saying the most of us are not professionals, and I, for one, STILL don't know what I'm looking at or what you see.  But, I'd like to so I can learn.  Any help like, count X lobes from the right, look at the X irregularity, color, etc.  Better yet, and I know you're not computer savvy, it'd be nice if someone would use circles and or arrows in PAINT to show the problem.

[Benz Dr.]

All good points John, which brings me to another point. Everyone wants pictures today. If you offer a spark plug for sale they want a picture of it.
 
Even with a picture, not everyone will see things that are hiding in clear view. I the case of said picture of the cam shaft, I knew the problem was going to be on the cam because that's what the picture is showing you - a cam shaft. The problem cam lobe in the picture is the fourth one from the end of the cam shaft. This is the lobe that runs the intake valve on number 5 cylinder. I guess someone could go back and circle the place on the picture where they want everyone to look.
If it was not pointed out that something was wrong in the picture I doubt very much I would have seen it. If I was working on the car myself I would have seen it because I look for things like that. I would have caught it during the valve lash adjustments anyway. It takes years of expirience to spot little things like this, this one being one of many to look for.






I guess without pictures no one will figure out what was wrong with the 190SL engine. In this case, the main bearings were installed upside down. The hole from the main oil galley was completely blocked off so that number 1 and number 3 main bearing wasn't getting any oil pressure. The center thrust bearing was OK because was installed properly and number 2 and number 3 rod bearings were also OK because they were getting oil pressure fed through the crank shaft. Number 1 and number 4 connecting rod bearings were damaged because no oil was flowing through the crank from the blocked main bearings.

Had I drove this car, it would have siezed up with a lot more damage than scuffed bearings. Figuring out what went wrong is all part of the repair.   

[Neil Thompson]

Good effort I thought, educational too. Photo downloads were better than my efforts as well, well done - averaging 120 viewings a day with approx 40 members a day logging looks good too, any criticism unnecessary. Let's have another!

Neil