Whitewall tyres in the UK

[KevinC]

Russell

The cheapest whitewalls I have found are these at £73 each.  http://www.longstonetyres.co.uk/page/195-75sr14--hercules-whitewall.html
They are 195s though (not 185s) - I have seen 185s in the UK but they were closer to £200 each and given the difference I don't believe its worth the difference. If you find any 185s cheaper, let me know as I (the starter of this thread) still have not taken the plunge.

Regards

Mark.

Hold up a moment...what is it that you dont like about the 195 75 R 14's?

[Russell]

http://www.northhantstyres.com/main-tyre-pages/phoenix-tyres/18514-phoenix.html
these look right but a bit ouch !

why are these £250 a go when you can get maxxis 195/75/14 at about £85 each
is there something special about the phoenix at that price ?

[KevinC]

Interesting story....A company called "Coker Tire" in the US bought up a vast number of molds of no-longer produced tires and has since become THE source for original-type classic (there's that word again!) car tires. Since their production is  low and the tires are exclusive to them, they charge accordingly. The "new" tires that you are looking at are re-production Firestone Phoenix tires, not even produced by Firestone. See this link:

http://www.cokertire.com/185r14-phoenix-3-4-whitewall-tire.html

So guys dead-set on "originality" spring for the $1000 US. I don't disagree with them at all for going that route. I PERSONALLY don't see my car as a new car but a very nicely maintained used car and that's where I figure its obvious that wear and tear items aren't original anyway so I ended up buying five Bridgestone 195/75/R14 whitewalls for $300! So essentially decision came down to "Original-style" or a good quality "Aftermaket" brand.

Also, when considering TIRE SIZE check out this link below. Plug in 185/80/R14 vs 195/75/R14. In my mind, the a speedometer reading of a HALF PERCENT isnt an issue. My speedometer doesn't even kick in until I am doing about 20 mph! Old car quirks I am sure.

http://www.tacomaworld.com/forum/tirecalc.php

Like so many things. the tire size and brand selection decision is a series of trade-offs and what is going to make YOU happy!

Kevin 

[Markbhai]

Hold up a moment...what is it that you dont like about the 195 75 R 14's?

Hi Kevin,

The only thing is that they are not 'correct', but since I have clearly not 'taken the plunge' then clearly correctness is not worth £180 per tyre extra to me.

Cheers

Mark

[Russell]

problem is here in the UK we dont have  that bridgestone tyre in that size. we seem to have a brand called maxxis which i have never heard of and they are about £80 a tyre for 195/75/14 or i have the coker Phoenix things at £250 each at 185/75/14
i now want whitewalls but i dont know enough  about tyres to tell what i might be buying for £80

i am used to paying £250 and above for a tyre for other cars i have but i am not being mean but i do get about four times the rubber on each for that money

i certainly dont want to pay £80 for something i cant keep on the road in the wet for the sake of a white circle though.

ho hum

[Neil Thompson]

Michelin MXV 185 14, expensive, no white wall, but correct for the car and transforms the drive. I took off some normal Michelins late summer and couldn't believe how much better the car drove - the sidewalls seemed much stiffer allowing less roll. Also the car felt very sure footed in bad rain encountered on the way home from the Euro event in Belgium.

Neil

[Russell]

yes from everything i have read so far Neil a good fit to the car and would be my choice for non whitewalls.

[Russell]

here is a an odd thing, I had a PM from Brian who has fitted 205/70/14 hankook whitewalls to his 1970 SL and says they are great with a slightly more planted look and great in the wet so i am assuming that he would have the 6" wheel as opposed to the 5.5" on the early 230's like i have.
has anyone fitted a 205 to a 5.5" 230SL era car.
they are the same diameter as the stock ones.
russell

[kampala]

My 250sl came from the previous owner with Phoenix tires.  They were the original owners of the car.  They always went to MB dealer for all service and dealer put these on just prior to my purchase. I have only owned this car for a few months and it's my first pagoda so can't provide a comparison with other tires.   Here's a couple of photos since this topic was about whitewalls.

Best,

Oz

[mbzse]

Michelin MXV 185 14, ... no white wall, but correct for the car

The Michelin 185-14, just like the Vredestein Classic's, can certainly be fitted with white-wall at an additional charge.
two vendors are:
http://www.oldtimer-reifen.com/en/
http://www.oldtimerreifen-moeller.de/english/index.html
/Hans in Sweden

.

[KevinC]

here is a an odd thing, I had a PM from Brian who has fitted 205/70/14 hankook whitewalls to his 1970 SL and says they are great with a slightly more planted look and great in the wet so i am assuming that he would have the 6" wheel as opposed to the 5.5" on the early 230's like i have.
has anyone fitted a 205 to a 5.5" 230SL era car.
they are the same diameter as the stock ones.
russell

My car had 205's on it when I bought it. I didn't care for that much wider of a look but that's just me. I dont believe that size will fit on the spare tire holder in the trunk. The diameter is actually 9mm in diameter smaller than the 185/80/14's....

http://www.tacomaworld.com/forum/tirecalc.php

[KevinC]

Never heard of these guys but maybe some ideas...?

http://www.groupbuytires.com/s?searchRank=-price&searchPage=1&field_product_site_launch_date_utc=-1y&field_availability=-1&field_browse=3211746011&searchSize=12&searchNodeID=3211746011&searchKeywords=195+%2F+75+%2F+14&field_keywords=195+%2F+75+%2F+14&refinementHistory=brandtextbin%2Csubjectbin%2Cprice

[Russell]

Russel,

If you have the original "2 piece"  hub caps, you really should concider the  tyres with a kerb ring.

Paul

sorry just noticed this Paladin. Enlighten me as i dont know why ? this is the onlypicture i have of the car taken dnkeys years ago and it isnt too clear but what do you mean by two piece

[KevinC]

Russell,

"Early" cars like ours had a combination of center "hub caps' and "trim rings" while later cars had a full one piece "wheel cover" therefore not requiring the outer ring. I am noticing in  the pic of your car that the trim are missing. These rings had a tendency to stick out pretty far thus encountering "curb rash" if the driver wasnt careful. The rub strip on the Firestone Phoenix extended out even further than the trim rings so one would scrape the rubber sidewall of the tire before the expensive ring.

Here are some details... check our the exploded view of the 2-piece version...

  http://www.sl113.org/wiki/WheelsTires/Hubcap

The pictures that Oz posted above show the 2-piece version off very well. Perhaps its the lighting or angle of the pic but it also looks like the rub strip is partially missing in the top pic.


Kevin

[KevinC]

My 250sl came from the previous owner with Phoenix tires.  They were the original owners of the car.  They always went to MB dealer for all service and dealer put these on just prior to my purchase. I have only owned this car for a few months and it's my first pagoda so can't provide a comparison with other tires.   Here's a couple of photos since this topic was about whitewalls.

Best,

Oz

Oz, Others may say other wise but Firestone themselves has not produced the "Phoenix" tire model in years which may suggest either of two things: these are new Coker reproductions that cost them about $1000 US to put on your car or that they are extremely old. You may want to have them double-checked by a third party for safety reasons.

[KevinC]

Hi Kevin,

The only thing is that they are not 'correct', but since I have clearly not 'taken the plunge' then clearly correctness is not worth £180 per tyre extra to me.

Cheers

Mark

Gotcha Mark. Agree on this end.

[Russell]

ah ok kevin now i am looking at it i can see the difference. i am into a set of those rings then for sure. looking at mine i couldnt tell i was missing anything.
i am still in a quandary about the tyres for sure.
the whitewall phoenix cokers are a horrendous price £250 a corner and not a clue how they handle
or
i can go for some 205/70/14 hankook at cheaper but price but have no idea if they will fit the smaller 5.5" wheel as opposed to the 6" that they were fitted to later
or
i can do the michelin MXV-P 185/80/14 with the bump strip that people say handle well.

[relbhcb]

Coming in late to the discussion, but in the UK you can also get some Vredestein 185HR14 to fit - I have just put them on my 1964 230SL and they are fine so far. They include a "rubbing strip", and are much less than the Michelin.

http://www.longstonetyres.co.uk/search?searchMethod=searchTerm&searchScope=site&searchUrl=&sortBy=&category=&searchTerm=1027&x=26&y=9

[Larry & Norma]

The Vredesteins are cheaper still at mytyres.co.uk
Look under 'old timer tyres'

[Dave H]

Looking for the same thing myself... Following a link from an earlier thread I e mailed mail@oldtimerreifen-moeller.de.
They instantly replied this morning. They specialise in whitewalling tyres by vulcanisation.
They can give you 20 or 40mm whitewalling on any tyre.
They can supply vredstein 185 R14 H90 sprint classic with ridge for Euro 210.
With a VAT registered number that would be export price to the UK ie minus 20% mswt.
Works out at around £140 in real money.
Mytres.co.UK are a penny off £90 for the same tyre in black only.
Both company's  have them in stock as of this morning.

[KevinC]

ah ok kevin now i am looking at it i can see the difference. i am into a set of those rings then for sure. looking at mine i couldnt tell i was missing anything.
i am still in a quandary about the tyres for sure.
the whitewall phoenix cokers are a horrendous price £250 a corner and not a clue how they handle
or
i can go for some 205/70/14 hankook at cheaper but price but have no idea if they will fit the smaller 5.5" wheel as opposed to the 6" that they were fitted to later
or
i can do the michelin MXV-P 185/80/14 with the bump strip that people say handle well.

Descisions....decisions... a lot of folks say that the repro Firestone Phoenix handle just fine. My theory was that tire technology has come so far since these cars were built that even a mid-grade tire like my Bridgestones will do the job unless you are running in an Autocross regularly. I had high end speed rated tires on a tuned Audi TT at one time but that's what the car was designed for. As I mentioned, I had 205/70/14s on my stock original steel wheels when I purchased my car and they fit just fine ...just too wide for my tastes and the trunk (boot) fitment. There are a handful of suppliers that handle name brand and off brand 195/75/14' whitewalls here in the US. Not sure why you can't get them in the UK. Had you considered the Hercules tires mentioned earlier in this post? Maybe research reviews on those? Don't know if I have helped you here or not! 

[KevinC]

What don't we like about these?

http://www.longstonetyres.co.uk/page/195-75sr14--hercules-whitewall.html

[Markbhai]

Russell

Good point regarding the tread, I hadn't considered that.  The gearing is not someting to be overly concerned about, it is only a tiny amount of difference and not something which would have any significance, indeed 195's are quite widely used as 185's are not so easy to get hold of.

It would be nice to hear if anyone had used the Hercules Tyres?

Cheers

Mark.

[Russell]

What don't we like about these?

http://www.longstonetyres.co.uk/page/195-75sr14--hercules-whitewall.html

i think for most might be nothing more than i am looking at tyres for £250 a corner that people know or suddenly we have tyres at £73 that to be honest i have never come across. i dont reall know enough about tyres to be able to make a call. a bit funny really as i am used to just going to buy whatever it is supposed to have but there are way too many options to choose from  my brain hurts
well it is good to know that the 205's fit. that hercules isnt a household brand here for sure.

it got more confusing with dave finding those vredstein's too

[kampala]

Oz, Others may say other wise but Firestone themselves has not produced the "Phoenix" tire model in years which may suggest either of two things: these are new Coker reproductions that cost them about $1000 US to put on your car or that they are extremely old. You may want to have them double-checked by a third party for safety reasons.

Kevin, thanks for the insight on Phoenix.  They must be the Coker ones as they are clearly fresh and you were spot on with the cost as I have the receipt and its just over $1000 and it states that they had to be ordered and mounted a couple of weeks later.  Also, must be the photo as the rub stripe is in good shape ... didn't know I had a rub stripe until you mentioned it.   best

Oz