America's Worn W113s are Europe's Gold!

[Brian in NL]

I recently had my beloved '67 230SL exported from the U.S. to my new home in The Netherlands. Upon arrival at Rotterdam, the container containing the car was trucked to a handling warehouse where all the Customs paperwork and the car are processed. The manager let me and my wife wander through the warehouse to look at all the other cars awaiting pickup. To my surprise, there were about a dozen W113s from the U.S. (mostly from Florida, California and other dry states) about half in poor shape and the others in decent daily driver condition. As you can see from the line of cars outside, 70s SLs are also getting more popular for restoration.  Ford Mustangs and Jaguar X Types were common, too. The prices here for a fully restored SL are so healthy, restorers are snapping up the junkers in the U.S., which they can get for a lot less.  Here's a few I got pictures of.

[Cees Klumper]

On the origin of all these cars, I expect many were only briefly titled in California before being shipped over. Better for advertising purposes but not very truthful. BTW I hesitate to ship my El Camino to Florida due to all of the salt air there, at least near the coast ...

[Flyair]

The US spec Pagodas are offered for sale by most of European dealers. Amazingly also in the UK (despite being LHD).

If this trend continues, it may be hard to get those 500 Pagodas for the US 50th Anniversary  

BTW, Brian, this is for the first time I heard that Florida is a dry state...  

[gerster]

Yes, look here http://www.geevers-classic-cars.nl/aanbod#mercedes-benz more than 40 Pagodas for sale.

[Brian in NL]

OK, OK! Florida is NOT a dry state. Hey, it was late at night when I posted this!

Actually, I was thinking the red car had Florida plates, but they are actually Tennessee plates. That said, there are more than a few Pagodas surviving in the Sunshine State ... probably with more rust than some of these!

Brian

[Flyair]

Yes, look here http://www.geevers-classic-cars.nl/aanbod#mercedes-benz more than 40 Pagodas for sale.

That's amazing… just casually counting on this web, there are less than 10 pagodas non-US spec, one of them notably with the Italian small turn lights…the rest is US spec

nothing to add… Europe is getting back their children

[71Beige280SL]

The prices on the Pagodas are very interesting. There is a wide variation.

[KevinC]

Another two cents on "Florida" cars....I was living in south Florida when I was seeking out my 113. ALL of the cars that I looked at there had been transplants from the northeastern US, most likely as their owners grew older and moved themselves. I ended up buying mine in California!

[Brian in NL]

I visited the Van Dijk shop in Lisserbroek (Netherlands) to check up on the ongoing work on my 230SL today, and noticed that two of the W113 junkers that were in the showroom last month were gone. Here are their photos. 

Both of these cars came from California and were in very worn condition ... the blue one was really thrashed out. It looked like it had been sitting outdoors for many years in the sun and rain. My mechanic said they both were sold to Germans, who had them towed to Germany for restoration there.  The demand for these cars, even junkers, is really growing strong over here, especially in Germany. Van Dijk has a healthy side business of finding these wrecks back in the U.S., shipping them over and re-selling to people with the money to pay for a full restoration. If they want Van Dijk to do the work, all the better!

Although I am amazed a car in as poor a condition as the blue specimin here can be saved, it is good to know they have a future and that there are enthusiasts willing to spend what it takes to get them back on the road again.

Brian

[Cees Klumper]

This is really strange as there are plenty of really nice specimens that can be bought for less than half or one-third of what a proper restoration will cost. The only thing I can figure is that these cars go to people who are going to do all of the restoration work themselves. And even then.

[Brian in NL]

I thought the same thing, though I don't know what prices were involved.  Just the level of work and replacement parts needed to get these running and presentable seems mind-boggling. As the mechanic told me, there are some people for whom the cost doesn't matter ... they just want a specific model and year and will pay whatever it takes.  But still ...

[Flyair]

There is a restoration shop near the Polish German border called Auto Stodola (which means Barn) that nearly exclusively restores cars for German clients. It is like a little factory with 25 people. Although their initial specialization has ben the 190SL now they do more and more Pagodas. I was told that German resellers bring cars in virtually all conditions, including wrecks. Since their cheaper labor is a grand factor and apparently the quality is spotless, the have their time booked 3 year in advance. This may be the answer where those blue wrecks from Holland end up...  

if you want to have a look…
http://www.auto-stodola.com.pl/index3.htm

[Brian in NL]

Flyair, my mechanic mentioned the Polish shops and the owner of Van Dijk has visited them (not sure if it is the one you reference). He said the same thing you did, that it's like an assembly line and the cars come out looking great.  But he would disagree that the work is top-quality. 

For example, rather than replace a very rusty fender with a new replacement, they may sand and repaint it so it looks great, but after 5 years the rust deep inside breaks back through.  They also use a lot of filler.  So while they do good work for the price, and the cars look like new when they are done, the work may not last as long. Same with the engine work ... they may get it running, but opt not to replace things that should be replaced when doing an overhaul. 

I believe when it comes to auto restorations, you generally get what you pay for.

[Cees Klumper]

I've come to the conclusion that there are basically two ways to get a restoration done by someone else. First is you go to the most reputable places like Van Dijk, Kienle or the Classic Center. Then you are sure the work will be done very well (although from experience even there I can say maybe not entirely right the first time). You also know that you will pay the maximum price. A few years back, a full restoration of a Pagoda in ok shape to begin with would cost approximately €100,000, or $130,000. These days, it is probably some 20% higher, I don't know. Combined with the cost of the car ($25,000?)  this results in a total cost that the owner is highly nlikely to ever recoup. That's why I said "about half".
Then the second way is to not use the most reputable places. Then there are two extreme variations: the ones who take pride in the work and do it really well, but cheap. And the ones who do it poorly and equally cheap. For example, when I needed a new floor and a few other things for the El Camino in 2011 I went to an ok place in Geneva, who quoted me the equivalent of €7,000 for the work. I ended up going to a tiny shop in France, who did it for €1,700. I visited several times and they made lots of photos, and I have seen other work they have done. It's really good work.
So the challenge is, for those not wanting to go to the top-dollar places, distinguish between the very good and the not so good places. But a good restoration does not have to cost top dollar.

[66andBlue]

.... For example, rather than replace a very rusty fender with a new replacement, they may sand and repaint it so it looks great, ....

Brian,
from over here it appears that there is a simple reason for this, the infatuation especially of German buyers for cars with original fenders and welding spots in the engine bay.
It is the time of year when European buying agents swarm all over California looking for cars to purchase.  I have talked to three groups recently and all of them hesitated to buy cars with professionally replaced fenders unless the price was well below market value. When I asked whether they would prefer a car with replaced fenders but faked welding spots (even if the gaps were wrong and the work was done so-so) rather than a well repaired car the answer was "the former, because most buyers back home know little about these cars. But all the magazines tell them to look for the welding spots and the notches next to the head lights. They buy for the prestige of having one and don't want to be embarrassed when they show off the car and the missing spots are pointed out".

[mdsalemi]

...the infatuation especially of German buyers for cars with original fenders and welding spots in the engine bay...It is the time of year when European buying agents swarm all over California looking for cars to purchase.

This is the kind of bizarre buying behavior that simply taunts fraud. When I moved to San Diego in 1986, I was told "there are 5,000 surfers in California and 100,000 that dress like them..."  Similarly, there are a lot more advertised "California cars" than ever were shipped there to begin with.  With buyers like Alfred mentioned, this trend is likely to continue...

[GGR]

I've come to the conclusion that there are basically two ways to get a restoration done by someone else. First is you go to the most reputable places like Van Dijk, Kienle or the Classic Center. Then you are sure the work will be done very well (although from experience even there I can say maybe not entirely right the first time). You also know that you will pay the maximum price. A few years back, a full restoration of a Pagoda in ok shape to begin with would cost approximately €100,000, or $130,000. These days, it is probably some 20% higher, I don't know. Combined with the cost of the car ($25,000?)  this results in a total cost that the owner is highly nlikely to ever recoup. That's why I said "about half".
Then the second way is to not use the most reputable places. Then there are two extreme variations: the ones who take pride in the work and do it really well, but cheap. And the ones who do it poorly and equally cheap. For example, when I needed a new floor and a few other things for the El Camino in 2011 I went to an ok place in Geneva, who quoted me the equivalent of €7,000 for the work. I ended up going to a tiny shop in France, who did it for €1,700. I visited several times and they made lots of photos, and I have seen other work they have done. It's really good work.
So the challenge is, for those not wanting to go to the top-dollar places, distinguish between the very good and the not so good places. But a good restoration does not have to cost top dollar.

I have also noted that some people take pride in having their car sorted out by the most reputable shops. Being able to say "I currently have my car at so and so" or "I had this done by so and so" seems to be at least as important, if not more important to them, than the work being effectively done on their car. This recoups what Brian says, that some people buy for the prestige. So I guess it is more prestigious to have a car shipped in a closed transport half across the US, pay premium price and let people know about it,  for a job that could have easily been done by a local qualified person for much cheaper. I noted this trend several times at MB gatherings. Some astute professionals have understood this, and while they are certainly technically very competent, they also have put a lot of effort in building and marketing their reputation in order to target that specific clientele. Nothing wrong with that. But it's sometimes funny to see them act during gatherings as per the image they want to project on that particular clientele, and then see them behave differently (as the real persons they are) in different contexts.