Fuel Hose Problem

[dirtrack49]

Hi all.

Finally got back to working on my 66 230SL after two years sitting on jack stands. Also, had to re-registar for the Pagoda forum since I had become inactive. Best yet, I retired in June of this year. So....I have all kinds of time to work on several project cars and airplanes now.

The problem I am having is the fuel hose from the fuel pump to the fuel line, the one with only one fitting at the pump, 113-476-09-26, is about 4 to 5 inches short. I have the original fuel pump which I believe would be the long pump. While going about replacing all of the hoses, I find that this hose comes up short.

Has anyone run into this problem before, and if so, do you know of anyone with the correct length of hose? My guess would be that the suppliers are providing the hose that only fits the newer pumps. Or, did I just get something odd? I purchased the hose from Autohaus over 2 years ago.

And a word of caution to anyone else out there attempting to bring their car back to life. Make sure you replace all of the fuel hoses, radiator hoses, and anything else that is 40 plus years old. My fuel hoses broke off of the car in my hand after backing off the hose clamps.

Tom L.

[ja17]

Good advice Tom,

Those old fuel supply hoses do not like the new fuel formulations. The new hoses are made to deal with the modern fuel formulations. Be safe and check these lines.

[rb6667]

Hello Tom, This is the engine supply line you are talking about right?  The one with the fitting on one end that screws into the pump?  If so, and if you are not worried about using the original style hose, go to the auto parts store and get about 3' of Fuel injection rated hose. (Make sure it is fuel injection rated hose)  The size you will need is 3/8"s.  It's a tight fit...but will work. Cut off the crimped end of the fitting, and clamp the hose on both ends with the special fuel hose clamps that will not cut the hose when installed.

[tel76]

That particular hose is very expensive from MB, has anyone found someone who can replace the rubber pipe and re-crimp it in position as it was when new ?

[mdsalemi]

Tom L.

I had my hose fail last year; it failed at the crimp. I made a recent post about this when James Huber was wondering if a failure at that hose could cause some misfiring or similar. I related my experience with the exact issue.

I bought a new, OEM Mercedes-Benz hose from one of our vendors here, Dave Gallon of Gallon Restorations.

The cost was about $22.00 or so; maybe tel76 and I come from different worlds but that does not seem excessive in cost to me. The hose was actually too long for my car, and I needed to cut off about 6". I see that Miller's has the hose today for $39.00 (perhaps the cost is creeping up?) and K&K has it for $34.51.  The metal end is hook shaped, and has a flare fitting on one end that goes to a crimp to flexible fuel line.

[tel76]

Michael,
If you take the time to read the post from RB667 he is referring to the pipe that comes from the injection pump, it is an S shaped pipe and the last time I checked it was about £100 that to me is bloody expensive for what it is.
I will get an up to date price the next time I visit my local stealer.
Have a look at the SLS site,  07 Injection system, # 48, they have the part # as A129 070 06 32 but no stock.

[dirtrack49]

To make things more clear, the hose I am talking about is the one from the fuel pump at the rear of the car to the hardline which goes up to the engine compartment. It is the main feed from the pump with only one fitting at the pump. I originally got the hose from AutohausAZ and it was listed as #113-476-09-26. While looking for the hoses that need to be replaced in the engine compartment, I found that the only supplier so far that carries all of them to be K&K Mfg. They list the same hose as #111-476-09-26. That would be a hose for an earlier vehicle. My guess, and hopefully will be able to confirm this on Monday, is that the hose listed as 113 vs. 111 is for the later cars only that had the smaller fuel pump installed. Therefore, the hose starting at 113, has been made too short for the earlier cars.

If all else fails, I will most likely replace the hose as rb6667 has mentioned.

Thanks to everyone for your post. I will update this thread when I finally resolve the matter.

Tom L.

[ja17]

Alternative #3....There are usually two or three businesses in most cities which rebuild all types of AC, hydraulic and fuel hoses. One of these places should be able to  crimp on some fuel injection hose onto your original fitting. The pressure in the system is usually under 20 psi. Use a fuel hose rated at 60 psi or more.

[J. Huber]

Wasn't sure whether to respond here or my own thread -- probably will to both...

I finally crawled under to figure out why my car leaked a steady drip of fuel when I turn on ignition...Jacked up one side, loosened the metal protective cover, and tested it out. It is definitely the upper hose that is shown at K&K number 111-476-09-26. Fitting on pump side, clamp on the other. Mine is braided.

The leak is not at the connections but appears to be in the hose (split?). It just soaked up a couple inches back of fitting when ignition is on.Gotta be the hose, right?

Now where my problem and Tom's might differ is my car seems (and I think I remember this change) to have the shorter pump. That might be why I have the 111 hose?

Unfortunately, actually changing out this hose is above my pay grade, so I gotta take it in. I could probably do it if I had a lift....I am thinking I should buy the hose first so the mechanic doesn't need to figure all this out...

[mdsalemi]

If you take the time to read the post from RB667 he is referring to the pipe that comes from the injection pump

Original post was by Dirtrack49, and the post said Fuel Pump to Fuel Line…to me the fuel pump is at the rear of the car. The injection pump is in the engine bay, but I guess some people interchange the terms?

He then said in a second post, To make things more clear, the hose I am talking about is the one from the fuel pump at the rear of the car to the hardline which goes up to the engine compartment.

I guess I just don't understand. But regardless: Joe Alexander has a wonderful solution, as custom hose manufacturers are in all locations in the USA. Most will make or crimp a hose while you wait at a reasonable cost. Even some special hoses, with flare, banjo and other fittings, special braids, metric, etc. are all do-able. I would guess in this case a custom-made solution might not look 100% but would be less costly…and this is regardless of which specific hose you are talking about!

[mdsalemi]

Unfortunately, actually changing out this hose is above my pay grade, so I gotta take it in. I could probably do it if I had a lift....

Jim, trust me on this, my memory is pretty clear as it was only 7 months ago.  You don't need a lift and you don't even need to jack up the car. Jacking might make it a bit easier but it isn't necessary unless you are maybe a bit stout; all you need is to get your hands together hear the fuel pump, and one on the clamp by the fuel hard line. I'm not tall or large, and I was able to do it.

The first thing I did was NOT turn my car on for some time, to relieve pressure in the lines.
Disconnect the ground to the battery.
Then I removed the fuel pump cage.
Get a small tray like a disposable baking pan, fill it with oil dry or cat litter.
Wear disposable gloves to keep gas off the hands.
Remove the clamp at the hard line end, and the fitting at the pump.  You need double wrenching on the latter.
Remove hose, fuel will come out into the pan.
Replace with new hose.

Total time, no jacking (and no joke either), was about 40 minutes. Yes, best to have a new hose on hand…A pro could do it in about 10, but I'm not a pro.  

[J. Huber]

Thanks Mike. You make it sound so doable... Although, even as I am fairly slim, crawling under the Pagoda is always tight for me. Maybe its my distinguished Patrician nose that slows me down...

Anyway, ordered the hose from K&K and once its here, I might get brave. I'll let ya know....

Good luck Dirtrack Tom on your issue.

[mdsalemi]

Thanks Mike. You make it sound so doable...

Jim, it is doable, but I didn't say it would exactly be comfortable! If you do jack up the rear it will be considerably easier--all you need is one jack stand, and a couple of inches will make a lot of difference. I did mine whilst in the garage, so I was half in the garage under the car, with the legs in the driveway!  I didn't want to push the car out as the driveway has a slight slope and I didn't know if I'd have much control w/o the power brakes and steering functioning.

I didn't have any room for the jack!

[dirtrack49]

Talked with the people at K&K yesterday. They only had the hose in stock that was listed as 113-476-09-26. They decided to order the hose listed as 111-476-09-26 to see if they were different lengths. They will get back to me with the answer as soon as the hose comes in.

The gal that I spoke to, was under the impression that the 113 hose was probably for the later 280SL and anyone who has replaced their fuel pump with the newer shorter fuel pump version. That would most certainly explain the 4 inch shorter hose.

A word of caution to anyone ordering many parts at a time from the vendors during your rebuild or restoration. Many of these cars have small differences in what is required from year to year. If you are attempting to restore your car to as close to original as possible, make sure you spend some research time in what parts are available from the various vendors. Or, if you are like me, you may become a small parts supplier for the various vehicles you may own, without any intention of doing so.

Will update when I find out the answer.

Tom L.

[mdsalemi]

Talked with the people at K&K yesterday. They only had the hose in stock that was listed as 113-476-09-26.

That's the part number I ordered, not the 111. http://www.rmeuropean.com/Part-Number/Fuel-Line-With-%281%29-Metal-Fitting-To-Fuel-Pump-__1134760926_COH_A13F8393.aspx is the aftermarket Cohline. I bought mine from Dave Gallon had the OEM for $17.84 when I bought it. He also offered me the Cohline for $13.89. I have the newer fuel pump and did have to cut off excess hose with the OEM.

I did save the excess because you never know when you need a good piece for some emergency.

[dirtrack49]

Got a message from K&K yesterday stating the length of the hose numbered 111-476-09-26, measures 22 1/2 inches for the hose portion not including the fitting. This would be the same length that the original hose was I removed from the original long fuel pump. Apparently, the hose marked 113 from Autohaus, is too short at what I measured to be 18 inches. It likely would fit a vehicle that is using the newer shorter replacement fuel pump.

Tom L.

[J. Huber]

Well, since I hijacked this thread once already -- thought I'd do it again -- with an update. I had a leaking fuel hose and ordered a replacement from K & K. I ordered the part number 111-476-09-26. It came yesterday and today I crawled under and gave it a whirl. I decided to jack up the car to give me some extra room. Used the lift points recommended in another thread and placed j-stands under both sides. I used the jack under the differential for added security. The removal was a little challenging for me because the darned pump cover was kind of in the way. I could have unhooked the fuel line to the tank to get it out of the way, but that connection didn't want to budge, so I worked around it. Disconnected the old hose, first at the pump, then at the clamped hard pipe. It was very much like Mike explained. Now, my underbelly is nowhere (I mean no where) near as clean as John's -- so I looked like a chimney sweep when I was finished....

Anyway, I connected the new hose -- and while it was slightly different (the curvature of the fitting was a trifle different and it was more silver than the old one which had a goldish hue) -- it worked just fine. I trimmed about 4 inches off the clamped end and once on, tightened it all up. Re-attached the pump cover and tested her out. All good! Took a nice drive and I am happy to report we are leak-free and running happily in 2014!

Thanks for the help.

[mdsalemi]

  told you you could do it! Excellent!