radio system 230SL 64

[Russell]

i have head a look through here but cant find what i need. i have a non standard radio system in the car with some really odd speakers as well.
does anyone know the part number of the stereo, i am assuming a becker and a picture of what it might look like so if i cant find the original i can get one similar.
also the speakers i had looked like like a right bodge stuck in the front doors so out context i cant believe they were like that.
anyone got a picture or a clue what the speakers were or looked like

russell

[Rolf-Dieter ✝︎]

Hi Russel, you should find here what you need.

Check it out ----> http://www.beckerautosound.com

In my case I have the original Becker radio, it does not work. I purchased a $300- Bluetooth speaker, the BIG JamBox, works like a charm with my iPad or iPhone. Some day I may upgrade my sound system when in New Jersey ... not just now.

[66andBlue]

i have head a look through here but cant find what i need. i..

You can use a stereo but I believe for your car a mono is the original OEM.
See:
http://www.sl113.org/forums/index.php?topic=19517.msg137355#msg137355
http://www.sl113.org/forums/index.php?topic=13701.msg93061#msg93061

[Russell]

thanks guys, i have no idea now what size the hole is or if it changed, i will need to go and measure it and then see my options.
anyone know what speakers are suppose to look like or were ?
there are some black square things in it now

[Rolf-Dieter ✝︎]

Have a look here Russell ---> http://www.sl113.org/wiki/Electrical/Speakers

Some cars only have one speaker in the dash (Center under the wood grill), others have the forgoing plus 2 small speakers as shown in photos (in the above link) in the food wells.

[scoot]

thanks guys, i have no idea now what size the hole is or if it changed, i will need to go and measure it and then see my options.
anyone know what speakers are suppose to look like or were ?
there are some black square things in it now

Post a picture of what is currently in your dash.  If you have a DIN size radio your dash has been cut. 

[Russell]

Hi Russel, you should find here what you need.

Check it out ----> http://www.beckerautosound.com

In my case I have the original Becker radio, it does not work. I purchased a $300- Bluetooth speaker, the BIG JamBox, works like a charm with my iPad or iPhone. Some day I may upgrade my sound system when in New Jersey ... not just now.

wow i thought th speakers i was looking at were really odd looking and couldnt be original but that picture looks just like them. i might be in luck.

[Russell]

Post a picture of what is currently in your dash.  If you have a DIN size radio your dash has been cut. 

this is the hole



this was what was in there sorry about the quality of the photo. i am guessing not original and the hole has been enlarged to full din maybe



what would be best to fit back into it now to look a bit original and in keeping but maybe sound ok

[hkollan]

wow i thought th speakers i was looking at were really odd looking and couldnt be original but that picture looks just like them. i might be in luck.

Russel.,

If you are looking to go the original way, you need one dash mounted center speaker, and a small faceplate Becker radio for your 230 sl.
The center speaker is available fom several sources, one place is Königs Klassik radios http://www.koenigs-klassik-radios.de/_plentyMarkets/Spezial-Lautsprecher-fuer-Mercedes/a-31122-27-0-0-0-0/
If the hole has been enlarged as you suggest  to DIN size you could compromise with a DIN sized Becker preferably with old style buttons, or change the radio mounting plate which I believe is still available.

Hans.

[Rolf-Dieter ✝︎]

Russell, this may also help you it has detailed instructions and sketches to clarify things.

Click here ---> http://www.sl113.org/wiki/Electrical/Radio#RadioInstall

If the hole is too large to install the original radio you can always fabricate a kind of washer plate that you then include in your installation and place it from the back side of the larger hole. Just a thought that is what I would do. When I got my car the previous owner (a lady) had an after market tape deck radio installed I removed it and reinstalled the original Becker that came with the car. I was happy to find that the original radio opening was not alterd and that all parts reqired to reinstall the original Becker radio came with the car.

[66andBlue]

.....  what would be best to fit back into it now to look a bit original and in keeping but maybe sound ok

It depends on your wallet and how deep your 'originality' desires reach.  
1. You could use the larger DIN dash cover that you have and buy a nice Becker stereo (Europa II or similar), add the speakers in the kick panels:
http://www.authenticclassics.com/Mercedes-Footwell-Speaker-For-Stereo-p/auth-003668.htm
and then you have a nice sound system that would be original for a 280SL.
2. Buy a correct dash plate with the small opening: http://www.authenticclassics.com/Mercedes-230SL-250SL-Dashboard-Radio-Mount-Plate-p/auth-003066.htm
the mono speaker for the dash: http://www.authenticclassics.com/Dash-Speaker-for-230SL-250SL-280SL-Other-Mods-p/auth-002720.htm
and then search for a small face Becker or Blaupunkt mono radio and you are completely original.
3. Forget about the speaker and radio completely, put a 'radio delete' plate over the opening: http://www.authenticclassics.com/Radio-Delete-Plate-for-Mercedes-230SL-p/auth-003068.htm
and then buy a portable box and iPod as Rolf Dieter suggested.

Since you are in the UK your best source for the radio and speakers might be Königs Klassik. I don't know whether they also sell the radio-delete plate and/or the dash cover plate.

[Russell]

gentleman that is all great information thank you. i think i will keep the size it is and find a unit that looks the age but with a more modern kick to it.
i will go and see the speakers i have but i think mine are flush and these original ones look surface almost.
i might get those boxes and see what i can then fit in them.

funny as my first job nearly 40 years ago was repairing Becker radio's.

russell

[hkollan]

and then search for a small face Becker or Blaupunkt mono radio and you are completely original.

Alfred,

To my knowledge only Becker radios were optional factory installed equipment.  Blaupunkt radios were often found in these cars but then dealer installed.

Hans

[66andBlue]

Hans,
since there are no option codes for Blaupunkt radios I agree with you that MB installed only Becker radios on the assembly line. But in my view a Blaupunkt radio installed by the dealer at the time of delivery does not render the car 'non-original'.

[mdsalemi]

Blaupunkts of the era are nearly unrepairable from what I'm told by those who repair radios. Since there are some organic, as it were, components in these radios when they go, they go. At 40 years+ a lot of them just don't work well anymore. The Blaupunkts were a way for the dealer to make some money--a dealer installed option was fast, direct cash into the pockets of the dealer.

Pricing of vintage Becker and Blaupunkts reflect their inherent quality.

But if it's a dealer installed item, it certainly is original. The Concours standard from MBCA for what it's worth, is "as delivered."

(hoping that the dealer didn't install pinstripes or chrome fender covers... )

[66andBlue]

Michael,
agreed, the Blaupunkt radios are difficult but not impossible to repair. Königs Klassik sells repaired ones (check the web site) and the RadioMan here in San Diego also repairs them. Plenty of VWs, Karman-Ghias, etc  had them.
In the 70s and 80s dealers here also installed an aftermarket Philips radio called Tonmeister on which they probably made even more money since it was really cheap. Here is one in a 250SE coupe together with a reverbarator. Perhaps the '280SE GUY' will chime in because he knows more about this gimmick.  

[mdsalemi]

What's a reverberator?

Really esoteric would be a Grundig with shortwave bands! European dealers probably installed some of these, yes?

(n.b. my car had the dealer installed original Blaupunkt. In 2000-2001, Did not work; I called quite a few places and nobody would touch it. Frankfurt mono, I believe...got a Becker instead.)

[hkollan]

To me, to use the Concours standard from MBCA as  a way to define originality does not make much sense.
I view the state the car left the factory as a good start to define original. But there will be obvious exceptions, such as items mounted to protect paint, glass, fabric etc. during shipping, later to be removed by dealer before delivery is one of them. 
But if dealer installed items have part numbers, option codes or are referenced in official sales brochures I view them as original.
An example of this would be the Frigiking AC systems found in the pagoda cars.

Hans

[scoot]

If you have an enlarged hole then probably a later becker will fit just fine.  Trouble with that is it will look less than perfect as the knobs for it will be the big knobs instead of the little knobs.   Not the end of the world though.   You _might_ be able to attach little knobs instead, but the tone arm (if any) is going to look odd.

[scoot]

If you have an enlarged hole then probably a later becker will fit just fine.  Trouble with that is it will look less than perfect as the knobs for it will be the big knobs instead of the little knobs.   Not the end of the world though.   You _might_ be able to attach little knobs instead, but the tone arm (if any) is going to look odd.

FWIW a small face radio can be converted into a big face radio and vice-versa.  That would give you a way of having the correct size shafts for tone (if any). 

[66andBlue]

.... But if dealer installed items have part numbers, option codes or are referenced in official sales brochures I view them as original.

Hans,
good points.  What about the undercoating that dealers applied at the owners' requests before delivery?
Also, under your scenario any 280SL with a sun roof would no longer be an original car because there were no MB option codes and Webasto and Golde installed them after delivery to the owner. On the other hand MB did install these windows in other models of the same time.  Furthermore, in later years MB did not mind showing them in PR material - or may be those were dealer ads. 

[hkollan]

Alfred,

Extra undercoating would make the car less original yes.
Regarding the sunroofs, strictly speaking I would not consider them as original equipment unless
they could be special ordered by the customer with MB pricing.  If it hadn't been for the weight issue it probably would
have been an original option. Still would be cool to have though.  ;-)

What about this scenario? Take the extra sidemoldings installed(with screws) by many dealers perticularly in California
 on  w113 and w111 cars not having the side moldings found on w108 models.
An owner decides during restoration to strip the car for a concours level bare metal paint, welding shut all the screw holes to leave
moldings off, to obtain the factory look. Such a  car should then according to MBCA Concours std.
have points subtracted since its no longer "as delivered" or?

Hans

[280SE Guy]

What's a reverberator?

Michael,

The reverberator was evidently before your time. It was an inexpensive way to turn your AM radio into a stereo sounding unit with the addition of a rear speaker. Not having a lot of money at that time I bought a reverb unit for my 1961 Ford Starliner from JC Whittney for around $20.00 in 1967, added a $7.95 rear speaker and had the sound of "stereo" in my car. More can be found about the reverb in this article. http://phscollectorcarworld.blogspot.com/2013/03/the-car-radio-reverb-system.html


Regards,

280SE Guy

[mdsalemi]

To me, to use the Concours standard from MBCA as  a way to define originality does not make much sense.
I view the state the car left the factory as a good start to define original.

Hans, you have to start somewhere, and "as delivered" is about as good as you are going to get for somewhere; to say it doesn't make sense, well, doesn't make sense.
The difference between "as delivered" and "as it left the factory" are simply dealer installed options.
As delivered can have several interpretations, and I suppose it is up to the judges to choose.
If you had a car in an MBCA Concours, and a judge was going to deduct a point for not having a Becker radio, showing them an original dealer receipt for a Blaupunkt installed at time of vehicle purchase would probably save that point. Having an early 80s Panasonic cassette radio would certainly cause a point loss.
I don't know about dealer added side molding--that's a bit invasive and I don't think any Concours standard would allow such a thing…

Yes, a reverberator was a bit before my time.  Sounds like something you could have bought at J.C. Whitney at the time!

To Rolf-Dieter's point, the other day while at Sam's Club, I noticed two different BlueTooth speaker systems available. I'd have to think that this is the way to go for ease and quality of sound.

[Rolf-Dieter ✝︎]

To Rolf-Dieter's point, the other day while at Sam's Club, I noticed two different BlueTooth speaker systems available. I'd have to think that this is the way to go for ease and quality of sound.

Michael, it truly is the way to go in my book. Just think of all the use one can have of this portable Bluetooth speaker ....

1) Take it along in my car and have fantastic sound near by.
2) When not driving it is on my desk having better sound then my computer speaker.
3) When taking my Pagoda for a spin and taking a rest to enjoy nature or at a car show, break out the fold up chair have a snack and listen to great music.
4) During the summer time in my garden take it anywhere and relax.

All the while I can enjoy my favourite music that is already stored on my devices. A 12 hour rechargeble battery life, no ear plugs or wires to fumble with what else does one need oh yes for me this is the way to go.

Juges so far have noted my Becker radio and none of them have turned it on to see if it works well it does not work and only came with one original speaker in the center dash, I can just emagine how it would sound if it would work