Radiator Recore

[dakman29]

So the radiator recore is done.  The radiator shop installed a core with higher capacity tubes and the cooling system is functioning perfectly.  I told the shop that diagnosed the problem that I wanted the radiator removed out the bottom of the car so the hood (bonnet) did not need to be removed.  They said they had not done it that way before but they would try.  First I got a call from them saying it looked like they could take it out that way.  The next call I got was after they had removed the rad. from the top of the engine bay (hood removed).  They said that they couldn't break the oil cooler loose easily and didn't want to damage anything so they took it out the top.  When they called to say the rad. had been re-installed and I could pick up the car they said,  but . . . when reinstalling the hood, one of the four nuts attached to the inside of the hood to receive the mounting bolt had broken free and dropped down inside the unaccessible space in the hood.  They tried to fish it out but could not. They remounted the hood with three bolts and it is functioning seemingly fine.  Obviously it was designed to have four bolts in place.  So, first question is how quickly do I need to find a solution for the problem, meaning do I risk damaging the hood by raising and lowering it with a missing bolt.  Next question is what is the recommended fix, and finally, how shady or perhaps dishonest is the shop.  I say that because when I picked up the car I asked them to show me what had prevented them dropping the rad. out the bottom.  Guy pointed to the large nut fastening the oil cooler line to the oil cooler and said it couldn't be broken free.  It didn't occur to me at the time, but later I started thinking that if that was the case, how did they get the rad. out of the car at all.  I'm going to go back to the shop on Monday with my concerns but was hoping for some thoughts from the forum before doing so.  Thanks.

[Rolf-Dieter ✝︎]

Reinstallation of my radiator was completed last Thursday after re-core. A radiator shop in our little town that also handles race and track cars did a fine job $403 to re-core plus plus antifreeze $24- and tax all is well again with my Blue Tornado

No problems encountered removing it from the bottom or re-installing it. Thanks Mike for your guidance.

[andyburns]

Hi Rolf,

Just wondering if your going to do your thermostat at the same time for good measure.   

[jameshoward]

Easy to test it. No point throwing away good money without testing it first. Requires kettle plus thermometer and a thermostat. I still have the replacement one I bought to change it when some bright spark suggested I test the original. Worked fine.

My spare is for sale....

[andyburns]

James are you running a 79 or 87 degree thermostat.  I just replaced mine and am a bit worried that the new one is 87.  I suppose in hotter countries the lower one is the go.  The thing is I dont know if little old New Zealand fits into this category. 

[Rolf-Dieter ✝︎]

No Andy, I am leaving well enough for now alone. The joint of the housing was leaking due to erosion when we changed the thermostat and the fan clutch last year. The Benz Dr. (Dan) and his boys fixed it and so far it is not leaking, however I keep my eye on it

[Jordan]

dakman29, not sure about the oil cooler line.  I have a 230SL so thought maybe it might be different since you have a 280SL, but RD also has a 280SL and he got his rad out the bottom.  Perhaps the shop you used was just too lazy to raise the car up enough to slip the rad out the bottom.  Regardless, they should supply and install the 4th bolt if they are the ones that removed and lost it.  You should get the car back in the same condition you left it with them, except for the rad repairs of course.  Just my 2c.

BTW, don't know about others but I can tell my thermostat is working when I start the car cold and start driving it.  The temp gauge will climb to just above 80C and then I can see it drop back as I continue driving.  Takes maybe 5 minutes of driving to see it drop back.  I am assuming this is the point at which the thermostat opens.

[Bonnyboy]

Regarding the 4th bolt in the  the hood - there is lots of discussion on the site about that 4th bolt - the captive nut breaks free and the solution is to cut a hole beside the hole in the hood and slide a threaded metal plate in there to replicate the captive nut - there is added tension on the single bolt on the one side - you be the judge - 1 bolt holding your hood down or two?

I don't know of any easy fixes without cutting up your hood - anyone else ever find a way of securing the hood without a captive nut to attach to? 

[garymand]

There are very few cars out there with hoods that open "backwards"  Radiator guys are not usually the sharpest knives in the block!  I seriously dought the even tried not to take the hood off.  And once they got started, there was to turning back.  They could have broken the captive nut off going or coming.  It is kept in aluminum!  Should I say again, very few cars out there are made of aluminum!!! And radiator guys..... 


I don't know about you, but I open my hood a lot.  Very frequently!  The hood is raised with one hand on one side and the coun ter spring is under very high tension.  Those two little joints supporting the hood hinges are, I would say 'a bit delicate'  Have the idiots repair your hood, emmidiately.  If they refuse, take it to a good body shop and pay the body shop then sue the ham hands in small claims court.  I seriously doubt they got you hood back in there right.  Sorry.

[66andBlue]

...  Next question is what is the recommended fix, and finally, how shady or perhaps dishonest is the shop. ...

Dakman,
you should get it fixed, but I would not trust a radiator guy to do it correctly, certainly not that crew.

[garymand]

Good point.  My assumption was they would refuse.  The risk is they will screw it up some more. 

[dakman29]

Thanks for the suggestions.  I am an attorney and fully versed in the remedies that the law may provide. I guess if I were an engineer I could figure these mechanical questions out for myself.  First I should explain that there are two shops involved.  The foreign car independent shop diagnosed the problem and were the ones who removed the rad.  They then sent it out for the recore.  The rad shop is blameless here.  I went to the independent shop this morning and explained that I couldn't understand their explanation for not dropping the rad from the bottom, as the oil cooler connection would have to be split either way.  They said that they couldn't get enough leverage on the fitting with the hood in place.  Still sounded a bit fishy.  I represent a number of new car dealers in town with body shops and probably won't get hit too hard on repairing the dropped nut.  The indy shop agreed to remove and reinstall the hood without charge so a body shop can undertake the fix.  That sounded fair.  On that point I checked Gernold's website and saw the picture of the plates with the sandwiched nuts for this repair.  Unfortunately they are out of stock.  I called to find out when they may be available.  Gernold said that they won't because his German supplier isn't making them any longer.  So we'll have to find some other way to secure the last bolt.  Gernold felt that the existing part could be repaired by cutting an access hole, removing the two rivets and reinstalling the captive nuts as from the factory.  So I guess we'll see. Of course if anyone out there has one of Gernold's plates and is willing to part with it, please let me know. Thanks again for all your help.

[garymand]

Sounds like you have it covered well.  Maybe we should add you to our list of resources!

[George Des]

You should be able to make one of these plates fairly easy with a flat piece of steel. Simply cut to a suitable size and drill and tap it with the appropriate size metric tap. I had to do this on my hood several years age. I did have to cut a small access hole on the side using a Dremel rotary tool with a small abrasive disk. When the hinge is installed it totally covers the access hole.

[dakman29]

"Sounds like you have it covered well.  Maybe we should add you to our list of resources!"

Always happy to try and help a member with an automotive related legal question.  Don

[Rolf-Dieter ✝︎]

Hello dakman29,

I hope you resolved all your issues with your radiator. Just an update, there is absolutely no need to remove the hood in order to slip out the radiator. You can confirm this by stoping at a good radiator shop that do this kind of work all the time. If they tell you (in future of course) the hood has to come off I recommend to get into the car and drive away and find the next shop. Removing the radiator from the bottom was no issue for me (I used 2 ramps - see photo). At the same time I cleaned and painted my oil cooler. All went well.