Is there any clamp holding oil dipstick guide in late 280SL?

[Pawel66]

I cannot really find it on any drawings (except Niemoeller). I cannot also see any obvious place on the engine where some clamp could be screwed to. But it somewhat is logical to me that something should be holding this guide other than the base.

Could you kindly confirm or deny the existence of anything holding the guide in place?

[DaveB]

I don't think there is one, it's just a press fit.
The early 230SL have a different arrangement, with a clamp on the dipstick tube.

[Pawel66]

Thank you!

Yes, I saw one on M127. Looked at many photographs of M130 - did not spot it.

[doitwright]

If you want to remove the dip stick tube on the M130 engine you need to drive it out from inside the aluminum belly pan.

[Cees Klumper]

There is such a clamp on my 280 engine, and also on several spare ones I have. It is attached to the same point of the block that the reservoir for the power steering system attaches to. I will try to take a picture today and upload.

[Pawel66]

Is there? Cees, then I would be much obliged if you could send a picture, thank you! I will then dig for the part number.

[Cees Klumper]

Hopefully these will be visible (not sure how photo upload works)

P.s. I'd be happy to send you one of these clamps, if you can't locate it through the usual suspects.

[Pawel66]

Cees, this is very kind of you, thank you!

I kept searching and in the meantime the only engine picture I could find that may show something like a guide clamp was the one below, from Wikipedia.

Thank you for your kind offer - let me look at what I can find and get back to you with kind request.

[Pawel66]

I think I found it in the EPC:
clamp A1879950037 (probably not available at MB), will have to find something similar
Bracket A1300100040 (available at MB)
Hose A6219970482 (available at MB)

All PN for late engine.

They are under Maj. Assembly Engine, 18 Engine Lubrication. Guide is under 01 Engine. Ihad to know what I am looking for to find it...

Thank you, Cees, again!

[Jonny B]

Most interesting. I checked my 280 SL and there is no clamp on the oil dipstick line. VIN 12730 (1970 model with Sept 69 build)

There is the bracket that Pawel mentions (1300100040) and clamp (1879960037) in place, but it does not clamp to the oil dipstick, it allows for a clamp to hold the oil line to the top of the oil cooler. This is also how it is shown in the diagram for Group 18 in the M130 parts book, 10180 (Edition B, as of May 1971). 

The screw and lock washer for the clamp are 000912006002 and 000127 006203 respectively.
In the attached diagram they are parts 80-83, part 85 is the hose referred to 6219970482

[Pawel66]

Look, of course, could be that I am wrong in my assumptions.

Where I was:
1. The part on the drawing and on the pictures in SLS catalogue looks similar to the part on the pictures from Cees.
2. When you get into parts descriptions in the EPC you will see that everything but the bracket is described "GUIDE TUBE TO BRACKET" (hose, clamp, screw, washer), when you highlight the hose, it mentiones the same clamp number, with the "GUIDE..." description. So those are for the guide tube for sure.
3. The only uncertain part is the bracket, you are absolutely right, especially that when you highlight bracket, you get also "Hose OIL COOLER TO FILTER" - so this bracket may be for that.

But again, it looks like the one on the pictures in SLS states it is next to "pump flange" - I think this is the one. Some theories may be:
1. its function changed over time and EPC is not really precise.
2. It performs more than one function - supports the guide tube and perhaps through a different clamp supports the oil hose.

I will give it a try and report back.

[Cees Klumper]

I think it's part 74 here on SLS:

https://www.sls-hh-shop.de/main/de/mercedes-230-280sl-w113/03-motor-m127-m129-m130/01-kurbelgehaeuse

[Pawel66]

Cees, yes, which is the same part as 49 here:

https://www.sls-hh-shop.de/main/en/mercedes-230-280sl-w113-/18-engine-lubrication

[66andBlue]

Pawel,
part 49 (or 74) could be one of the brackets shown in the first photo (black arrows).
The others show that the the dipstick tube (p/n 114 010 00 66) on a 1968/69 M130 engine had no support bracket. The printed version of the M130 spare parts list (#10180) also does not list any changes for this tube.

Also in the EPC it's easy to get confused with the "guide tube" for the automatic transmission oil dispstick tube.

[Pawel66]

Alfred, you are ruining the party! 

I see that one of them definitely is one of those brackets with an arrow. The other may be too, true.

I do not hink I am confusing it with transmission - the holder there is part of the guide, I think.

It is also true that I saw the bracket holding guide tube for the first time on the pictures from Cees. But then I found more traces (attached).

I am coming to the conclusion that perhaps size matters here as well (unfortunately!). Whenever I come across M130 shot at a right angle on the original car with the long guide - I see a trace of a clamp (attached)... One of them is 49er, I think.

I know I am talking to people who have seen hundreds of those engines. I will come back on this. I am probably wrong...

[Pawel66]

Sorry, just added pictures that were missing. Found one in the BBB in the meantine.

[66andBlue]

Pawel,
none of the pictures show 49er's car. His is an early one anyway: VIN is 003820 = June 1968.
the picture in the middle is a RHD
The photo in the BBB doesn't have to be a 280SL, could be a 300 SEL/8.

HOWEVER, your first pic is from a 1970 280SL on Brian's web site. Now if you had searched that car further you would have found your holy grail: the elusive clamp!

[66andBlue]

Pawel,
after looking at my 1964 230SL and the 1968 280SL a bit longer and searching the s.p.l. in more detail I came up with following for you.
The early 230SL M127 engines (from engine #169 - #2990 - with auto transmission) had a similar clamp (p/n 127 995 00 37) for the guide tube p/n 127 010 08 66. See first photo.

That guide tube was replaced (starting with engine #2991) by p/n 621 018 08 16 which was not clamped and remained in the M129 engines and the M130.983 engines until engine #005053.
Starting with engine #005054 a new guide tube p/n # 114 010 0066 was installed and that one required a clamp again. See 2nd photo. The clamp p/n listed is 187 995 00 63.

I wonder whether, this is a printing error and it could be the old p/n 127 995 00 63 that was on the early 230SL. However, it is also clear from my 230SL photo and the 280SL photo on Brian's 1970 280SL that the mounting orientation is different. I can't quite see in his photo the attachment point of clamp.

[mercakungen]

Happy new year for everybody,

My late 280SL has one. You can see it on the photo (Matti´s 280 SL topic).

[Pawel66]

Happy new year for everybody,

My late 280SL has one. You can see it on the photo (Matti´s 280 SL topic).

Happy New Year!
Thank you for contributing, very kind of you!

[Pawel66]

Alfred,

Happy New Year!

First of all: thank you very much for digging into this!
It makes me feel less guilty that I was bothering people for a minor detail - but we have the full story now!

It just was lacking logic to me that a fairly long and fragile pipe is not held in place by anything - so I asked. I lost hope after the first few posts and then Cees gave it a new spark! (thank you Cees!).

On the pictures: the 49er picture and one I attached looked similar at a glance, I was not paying attention to the brake booster - true. And I was missing, I think, the picture of the Holy Grail's engine from left side...

I am also happy to hear that my "size matters" theory is sort of confirmed - clamp for a longer pipe.

As for part numbers:
1. EPC/Webparts do not recognize the number you quoted (A1879950063)
2. What EPC says (and what I think I can see in your book) is clamp number A1879950037 (this is the one I quoted in my post above). Webparts says it is not available - I asked a question to the dealer. If it is not available, I will kindly request a favour from Cees, maybe he has one...

The million dollar question to me is: what is the bracket I need? 
I will see if I can fit the one I ordered.... maybe it is this one - that's my story and I'm sticking to it!

 

[Cees Klumper]

I'm sure I have a couple of these around. One caution in all of this I can see is that, although my car is a June '69 280 SL, the engine is not original to the car, but a factory replacement block. So other cars of the same vintage may well not have this clamp, if they still have the original engine. At least that is what I have retained from this rather detailed thread!

[Pawel66]

Thank you for, in fact, triggering it!

[neelyrc]

That guide tube was replaced (starting with engine #2991) by p/n 621 018 08 16 which was not clamped and remained in the M129 engines and the M130.983 engines until engine #005053.

My 280SL original engine #002901 (vin ...007749, Jan 1969) has no clamp as indicated in Alfred’s post.

[mercakungen]

Here´s a couple of photos I found.