Author Topic: Transmission Service Revisited  (Read 2947 times)

dirtrack49

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Transmission Service Revisited
« on: February 20, 2018, 01:21:20 »
Okay, I am feeling kind of stupid. Took everything apart to do a transmission service on my 66 230SL. Put it back together and now the pan gasket will not stop leaking.

When I took the old gasket off, I found that someone in the past had applied what appeared to be silicon sealer on the pan to the gasket. Unfortunately, I really did not take a lot of time to see if the pan itself was true to form.

I was under the impression from reading previous threads that the proper torque setting for the 16 pan bolts should be 7nm. However, I am now thinking that this setting was too much.

I have backed off the bolts to see if I can snug them up and stop the leaks. So far, no success.

Should I just take it all back apart and start over? Or, is there anything else I might try?

Think I might be using a lot of trans fluid to find the answer.
« Last Edit: February 20, 2018, 01:30:27 by dirtrack49 »

ja17

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Re: Transmission Service Revisited
« Reply #1 on: February 20, 2018, 05:43:39 »
Cross patterns when tightening the bolts and do not torque them all at once make two or three passes.
Joe Alexander
Blacklick, Ohio
1969 Dark Olive 280SL
2002 ML55 AMG (tow vehicle)
2002 SLK32 AMG (350 hp)
1982 300TD Wagon turbo 4spd.
1963 404 Mercedes Unimog (Swedish Army)
1989 flu419 Mercedes Unimog (US Army)
1998 E430
1974 450SLC Rally
1965 220SE Finback

dirtrack49

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Re: Transmission Service Revisited
« Reply #2 on: February 20, 2018, 15:33:01 »
Hi Joe,

Thanks for the input.

I cross pattern the bolts the first time around and made 3 passes. I am thinking that my torque wrench may be off on it's low end since when I went to back the bolts off they seemed rather tight for only being 7nm.

Now I am thinking that the pan itself may not be totally true and flat. I will bring the bolts back up again and see if they seal. If not, I guess I had better get another gasket, check the pan for straightness, and start over again.

Pawel66

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Re: Transmission Service Revisited
« Reply #3 on: February 20, 2018, 16:38:35 »
This is a very challenging part of the job - was for me anyway.

A great deal was about making the pan edge even (with a socket and a hammer or a brass bar and a hammer) to match the flat surface of the trans housing. Anytime the screws are torqued tight, the place on the pan edge near the screw hole gets dented upwards/raised.

If you have to remove the pan again, you may want to take a look at these potential dents/convexities (whatever the proper word is). Make sure you flatten them - tapping them down having a socket (I think 13mm) as support or a flat surface when turning the pan upside down and using a bar.

Make sure you use thin layer of the sealant, so that it does not get inside the trans when it is pushed out by pan as it is torqued.

Torgue - I think this is less than that (better check). You snag it with your thumb and two fingers holding just the head of the ratchet. You have washers there to prevent the screws from backing off. If you tighetend them too hard he first time, you might have made these dents/raised places again.

Start cross-pattern of snagging form the middle, four sides, then move one way by one screw at a time still using cross-pattern.

I was looking through the forum, but cannot find this torque for you. I found a mention of 1.3mkp for 280SL, which is around 12-13Nm, but I am not sure if this is correct. Kent is saying on the video "0.8Nm", but that cannot be correct probably. In any case - you probably do not have the wrench for this kind of torque. So just try to tighten it with "two fingers on the ratchet head". I did it twice, actually, worked both times.

Where I failed was the banjo fitting...
« Last Edit: February 20, 2018, 21:23:02 by Pawel66 »
Pawel

280SL 1970 automatic 180G Silver
W128 220SE
W121 190SL
G-class

Iconic

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Re: Transmission Service Revisited
« Reply #4 on: February 20, 2018, 18:44:53 »
Make sure you use thin layer of the sealant, so that it does not get inside the trans when it is pushed out by pan as it is torqued.
I believe no sealant should be used. Just the gasket. I had no issues with leaks when I did this with no sealant.
1970 280 SL Automatic, USA version, Grey-Blue (906G/906G), Blue leather (245)
1968 SS396 Camaro Convertible (owned since 1977 -- my first car :D)
1984 Porsche Euro Carrera coupe, LSD, SlateBlueMet/Blue
1998 BMW M-Rdstr Estoril Blue
1970 280 SL Automatic, Anthracite Grey-173G, Red Interior-132 - sold

Pawel66

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Re: Transmission Service Revisited
« Reply #5 on: February 20, 2018, 19:22:42 »
Could be. I have seen it used and I used it with no issues (pan side).
« Last Edit: February 20, 2018, 20:19:05 by Pawel66 »
Pawel

280SL 1970 automatic 180G Silver
W128 220SE
W121 190SL
G-class

wwheeler

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Re: Transmission Service Revisited
« Reply #6 on: February 22, 2018, 04:56:37 »
Sealant is a broad category. I never use RTV silicone sealant when using gaskets. I do think it is ok to use a gasket dressing like Permatex #2. It is non-hardening and won’t squeeze out if applied properly with a very thin film.
Wallace
Texas
'68 280SE W111 coupe
'60 220SE W128 coupe
'70 Plymouth Roadrunner 440+6

Pawel66

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Re: Transmission Service Revisited
« Reply #7 on: February 22, 2018, 08:16:12 »
No, no RTV silicone!! Dedicated sealant. Everybody from the US talk Permatex indeed.
Pawel

280SL 1970 automatic 180G Silver
W128 220SE
W121 190SL
G-class

dirtrack49

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Re: Transmission Service Revisited
« Reply #8 on: February 23, 2018, 01:13:02 »
Thanks to all for your advise.

Pawel66, I just got through resetting the pan bolts by hand only. I will give it some time and see if I still have any leaks. If so, I am going to take the pan off and make sure it is true (flat). Possibly use some sealant like I found on the pan when I took it off. I found the torque setting of 7nm on this website. I am thinking that my torque wrench was either off at the low end, or, that torque spec is incorrect. Thank you for your detailed advice.

I ordered another trans pan bolt and pan gasket just in case. By the way, finding the trans pan bolt was rather interesting. No one in the USA could seem to find one until I went to a Mercedes dealership in Bakersfield, CA and they found one in Fontana, CA. The trans pan bolt that is currently in the car has an aluminum washer on it that I can not remove from the bolt. It has a slight weep to it since I reinstalled it. When I get the new bolt, I am thinking I will use a copper seal instead of the aluminum one that is currently on the old bolt.


dirtrack49

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Re: Transmission Service Revisited
« Reply #9 on: March 10, 2018, 01:57:58 »
Finally, I got back to my transmission on the 230SL yesterday.

After disassembly, I found the pan to be warped from over torqueing in the past.

Lesson learned, always take a look at the trueness of the pan before reinstalling.

Thanks for everyone's help.

Tom L.