Tesla Model X

[mrfatboy]

Going back to the Tesla topic, I just saw this crazy article this morning 🤪

https://fox5sandiego.com/2018/12/03/dui-suspect-caught-sleeping-in-tesla-traveling-70-mph-officers-say/?utm_campaign=trueAnthem:+Trending+Content&utm_content=5c065f6f04d3014ac2dfdfe7&utm_medium=trueAnthem&utm_source=twitter

[thelews]

And, the 280s have power robbing pollution stuff on them that the 230 and 250 don't, I believe.

[UJJ]

Obviously this is not specific to the Tesla cars since all modern cars come with all kind of gismos, which in my opinion is dangerous because it takes away the focus on driving.
Perhaps the DUI driver will argue that he was not driving under the influence but the car was?

[mdsalemi]

Well, this was the story we were given by Daimler Benz marketing guys in the 80s. Considering that roughly 50% of all SLs went to the U.S., and 1967 was a pivotal year for DOT and EPA in the U.S., it seemed believable.

Anything is speculation and also believable.

In 1966, a Porsche 911 had 130 HP, and a 912 had 90 HP.  The BMW "Neue Klasse" 1800 had 90 HP.  The 1964 230SL of course had 148 HP, so it was better to start than the "competition".

What car line or the era wasn't offered with increasingly larger engines and more HP? I don't think any; they all were increasing all the time.

[waltklatt]

And, the 280s have power robbing pollution stuff on them that the 230 and 250 don't, I believe.

Remember back when I was 14 yrs old, following the 'Family Mechanic', driving a euro spec 280SL, and the mechanic driving an american spec 450SL.
I was way faster than the him and chirped the tires in each gear, even with the wide AMG wheels.

That's how bad the emissions were on the US models.
Now the emissions are much more improved.

Walter

[MikeSimon]

Murky, murky....When I brought my 1970 280SL over to the States in 1988 (less than 25 years old then!) and started to look into the differences because of the Federalization requirements, I had info the only difference in the motor was the cam with different overlap and a lower compression. Now everybody in the U.S. says they have a 9.5:1 compression head on their 280 and my German spec car has a 9.0:1 head. Go figure.

[49er]

 I had/have two “out of the box” SL’s, a 67 250 and a 69 280. Maybe it was just a marketing ploy but the 280 definitely felt more peppy. As far as the Tesla goes, there are lots of them here in CA and I have a few neighbors that own the model S and they are pretty happy with them. Just my 2 cents.

John

[mdsalemi]

there are lots of them here in CA and I have a few neighbors that own the model S and they are pretty happy with them

Any been crashed? See any repair bills? Talk to any independent repair facilities about what they found during a repair? That's the origin of the thread. Keep reminding yourself. 5 MPH collision. 90+ days wait for parts. $10,000+...

[MikeSimon]

most of these electric vehicles run in SoCal 

What I said!

[ghenne]

Here's a thought provoking presentation by Tony Ciba.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kxryv2XrnqM&t=164s

It runs almost an hour and is worth every minute. Big changes are coming: he explains why with careful research.

[waltklatt]

Has anyone seen the new offering from Aston Martin?
They seem to be offering a retrofit kit and installation to your vintage Aston Martin car for a fee.

The kit includes a full conversion to EV can and it's completely reversable back to the original gas unit, if you change your mind.

Wonder if Mercedes will be into that too.

Walter

[thelews]

You can do that on a Jag XKE too.

[MikeSimon]

You can do that on a Jag XKE too.

Wow... what a concept!! Take out that 12 cylinder and replace it with a soundless, wired, stator/rotor. I bet you can hook a lot of kids and turn them into real motorheads for the future.....

[mdsalemi]

In the 1968 song "Born to be Wild", first recorded by Steppenwolf, the first lines are:

Get your motor runnin'
Head out on the highway
Lookin' for adventure
And whatever comes our way

And those simple sentences, though perhaps meant in a motorcycle sense, sum up car culture quite succinctly. While I wouldn't discount some kind of culture developing (besides the green one) around electric vehicles*, I don't think there are a lot of young kids today pining for a Prius, or thirsting for a Tesla. They are appliances.

*we think of personal computers as appliances, too...but there is a culture or subculture that has developed around them with "hackers" overclocking their CPUs, and taking the architecture of the machine to limits and pushing the envelope with cooling systems, memory etc. So, I suspect in time something will happen with electric cars too...they'll be hacked for more power...

[Bonnyboy]

I don't know if we are different here in Vancouver Canada but electric vehicles are seen as being fun to many of the younger crowd.   Here at work we have 3 different electric vehicles, 3 hybrids and 3 regular petrol vehicles used as pool vehicles for staff.  The electric vehicles are the first to be booked as they seem to have the fun factor - the Chevy Volt in Sport Mode is lots of fun and I think that is what will sell these electric vehicles over time.  The Chrysler Pacifica has lots of "oomph" that makes it fun in town as well.     You just can't find them in the dealerships as they sell out as soon as they get them.

I know three people who bought used Nissan Leafs for cheap and the plan is to use them until they die and sell them cheap to the "electric car rebuilders" at that time. The expected horizon seems to be much less than a comparable gas vehicle but people seem to think they are saving so much money it will be worth it.    I still drive my 14 yr old Dodge 4x4 with a 5.7 hemi and gas hasn't killed me yet so I think the claims of saving tons of money with electric are over exaggerated.     There are businesses that have sprung up fixing the electric cars and batteries and it all seems to be heading the way the government wants, albeit a bit slower then they project. 

The electric bicycles and scooters are commonly upgraded significantly and are zipping in and out of traffic to the point where I think they are dangerous (coming from a scooter rider). 

The times are a changing.

[mdsalemi]

Ian,

Of course you are different in Vancouver. First, you are polite--the Canadian way. You gave us Diana Krall and so much more...but I digress. The weather. When you get to -10 and -20C (like so much of Canada does, and a large swath of the northern USA) and 32 to 37C in the summer, those EV folks might be singing a different song.

Last gas tank fillup I paid USD $2.08/gallon. Diesel is $3.30. electricity is steady at $0.12 kwH

The Volt is cancelled, so better get your fun with it while it lasts.

[mnahon]

Diana Krall is from Nanaimo. Yes, Nanaimo is on Vancouver Island, but that shouldn't be confused with Vancouver.

Isn't digression wonderful?

[66andBlue]

I'll tell you why, exactly: it's the elephant in the room that nobody talks about. I had TWO PEV plug-in hybrid Ford Fusions. As long as it's 72 degrees (or say between 65 and 75) and you don't need any heat or a/c, you are OK. As soon as you need climate control those batteries drain faster than a water tank shot up with a .50 caliber machine gun. Nobody talks about it, nobody at all. Where do you get that temperature range consistently? SoCal! What a surprise!

Different worlds ... different needs. 
"But the clincher is the Prius’s reliability. Ulaanbaatar may be the chilliest capital in the world. On a winter morning drivers must sometimes start their cars in temperatures below -30°C. Cars that run on petrol and diesel tend to sputter and die at such temperatures. The Prius can use its battery to power its electrical engine until the car warms up enough for the petrol engine to run smoothly—saving many a Mongolian from freezing frustration."

https://www.economist.com/asia/2018/12/22/everyone-in-mongolia-drives-a-prius

[Benz Dr.]

And, the 280s have power robbing pollution stuff on them that the 230 and 250 don't, I believe.

What power robbing stuff would that be?

[mdsalemi]

Well, Alfred--the Prius is a hybrid, not a PEV. Yes, in the world of Ulan Batoor it makes sense particularly when you can get used ones for $2K, and they don't carry the taxes of other cars.

I could only imagine a full PEV in the metropolis of Mongolia. Oh sure, there are power charging stations all over the place...NOT!

[66andBlue]

Hi Michael, yes I know that the Prius is a hybrid.
But you wrote "I had TWO PEV plug-in hybrid Ford Fusions" - so these are not hybrids? Then what they are "hybridized" with? 
Anyway, I just was surprised what makes certain cars popular in far away lands.

[mdsalemi]

Hi Michael, yes I know that the Prius is a hybrid.
But you wrote "I had TWO PEV plug-in hybrid Ford Fusions" - so these are not hybrids? Then what they are "hybridized" with? 
Anyway, I just was surprised what makes certain cars popular in far away lands.

Getting technical, Alfred, there are a number of cars out there....Hybrids with both batteries and gas engines, but no place to plug them in (such as the Honda Civic Hybrid Gen 1, 2003, the Ford Escape Hybrid Gen 1, 2005); hybrids that you can plug in such as the Chevy Volt, and the Ford Fusion Energi, the latter not to be confused with the Ford Fusion Hybrid. Then there are the pure PEV's such as Tesla with no gasoline engines at all.

I fully stand by my assessment of how ambient temperature, which results in changing climate control needs for a car, wildly affect how such a car can perform. That's why it's the elephant in the room, and why these are often tested in [temp stable] SoCal. For anyone to expect a battery to perform the same in -20 degrees and 105 degrees doesn't know about batteries, I'm afraid...

[AGT]

Jaguar launched its I-pace in the summer with deliveries coming on stream just as the European winter was coming. Sales were focussed on the Netherlands where a tax benefit would expire at the end of 2018 with Norway also taking a lot of the early deliveries. Initial range reports from owners were disappointing and Jaguar in the Netherlands has now confirmed different ranges for summer and winter. The summer range for combined city/highway use is 267 miles and the winter range for combined city/highway use is only 201 miles.

The extra resistance of winter tyres further impacts range although this can be offset by running your winter tyres on reduced size wheels.

Assuming you have the luxury of plugging the car in every night you can start your winter morning with a pre-heated interior and pre-conditioned battery pack which means that the warm up phase during winter need not impact that day's range.

Andrew

[MikeSimon]

It needs to be considered that the fuel mileage numbers are not being determined by actual driving cycles, but by running the vehicle on a dynamometer with simulated ambient and road conditions. How close these results are to the real world is anybody's guess. And there is ample evidence and history of such numbers being fudged in order to look good on a data sheet and in a comparison.

[mdsalemi]

I fully stand by my assessment of how ambient temperature, which results in changing climate control needs for a car, wildly affect how such a car can perform. That's why it's the elephant in the room, and why these are often tested in [temp stable] SoCal. For anyone to expect a battery to perform the same in -20 degrees and 105 degrees doesn't know about batteries, I'm afraid...

I went for a walk this morning with my iPhone at 95% charge. It was 5 degrees F. When I returned 40 minutes later, my phone--without use, but merely from ambient temperature--was down to 5% and in low power mode...