Author Topic: Another "Identify" Please  (Read 3840 times)

Harry

  • Full Member
  • Gold
  • *****
  • USA, TN, Knoxville
  • Posts: 742
Another "Identify" Please
« on: February 26, 2020, 00:17:20 »
Here is a bolt that I am unsure where it goes, but it has a ground, conical start.  It's not the shorter one that goes in to the timing chain just below the head but I remember it.  Just not sure where from?!

Ideas?

Harry
Harry Bailey
Knoxville, TN
1966 230SL
Automatic

ja17

  • Full Member
  • Platinum
  • ******
  • USA, OH, Blacklick
  • Posts: 7414
Re: Another "Identify" Please
« Reply #1 on: February 26, 2020, 05:07:07 »
"All thread" bolts are somewhat rare on these engines. Maybe a non-original substitute? Possibly AC compressor mounting bolt?
Joe Alexander
Blacklick, Ohio
1969 Dark Olive 280SL
2002 ML55 AMG (tow vehicle)
2002 SLK32 AMG (350 hp)
1982 300TD Wagon turbo 4spd.
1963 404 Mercedes Unimog (Swedish Army)
1989 flu419 Mercedes Unimog (US Army)
1998 E430
1974 450SLC Rally
1965 220SE Finback

stickandrudderman

  • Vendor
  • Platinum
  • ******
  • United Kingdom, England, Richmond
  • Posts: 2924
    • http://www.colinferns.com
Re: Another "Identify" Please
« Reply #2 on: February 26, 2020, 12:17:57 »
"All thread" is technically a screw not a bolt.
"Partial thread" is technically a bolt not a screw! (But I'm sure you knew that!)
Also, from my dim and distance past education, the difference between and "engine" and a "motor" is, IIRC, one is solid fuel powered and has no rotating parts (eg: a rocket) whereas the other is , well you get my drift and it was a long time ago.........
This particular screw is not something I recognise as belonging to a pagoda.

Harry

  • Full Member
  • Gold
  • *****
  • USA, TN, Knoxville
  • Posts: 742
Re: Another "Identify" Please
« Reply #3 on: February 26, 2020, 12:49:04 »
A/C compressor mounting bolt - perhaps.  So the conical lead is simply to facilitate starting the bolt in the threads?  I have mounted the A/C compressor bracket already but I'll look there anyway.

Thanks,
Harry
Harry Bailey
Knoxville, TN
1966 230SL
Automatic

MikeSimon

  • Full Member
  • Platinum
  • ******
  • USA, OH, North Royalton
  • Posts: 2477
Re: Another "Identify" Please
« Reply #4 on: February 26, 2020, 13:00:14 »
So, Colin, a "steam engine" isn't really an engine, it is a motor?
1970/71 280SL Automatic
Sandy Beige
Parchment Leather
Power Steering
Automatic
Hardtop
Heated Tinted Rear Window
German specs
3rd owner

Pawel66

  • Full Member
  • Platinum
  • ******
  • Poland, Mazowieckie, Konstancin-Jeziorna
  • Posts: 5494
Re: Another "Identify" Please
« Reply #5 on: February 26, 2020, 15:20:00 »
"All thread" is technically a screw not a bolt.
"Partial thread" is technically a bolt not a screw! (But I'm sure you knew that!)

One of the key mysteries of my life is solved.
Pawel

280SL 1970 automatic 180G Silver
W128 220SE
W121 190SL
G-class

stickandrudderman

  • Vendor
  • Platinum
  • ******
  • United Kingdom, England, Richmond
  • Posts: 2924
    • http://www.colinferns.com
Re: Another "Identify" Please
« Reply #6 on: February 27, 2020, 12:45:58 »
From t'interweb:
"“Motor” is rooted in the Classical Latin movere, “to move.” It  first referred to propulsive force, and later, to the person or device  that moved something or caused movement. “As the word came through  French into English, it was used in the sense of ‘initiator, A person could be the motor of a plot or a political  organization.”

“Engine” is from the Latin ingenium: character, mental powers,  talent, intellect, or cleverness. In its journey through French and into  English, the word came to mean ingenuity, contrivance, and trick or  malice. “In the 15th century, it also referred to a physical device: an  instrument of torture, an apparatus for catching game, a net, trap, or  decoy,” .

Today, the words are virtually synonymous. “Language evolves to take on  new tasks, Without thinking about it, we adapt to new  meanings and leave the old behind.” We talk about our car’s  dashboard, unaware that in the 1840s, the word referred to the board at  the front of a carriage that stopped mud from being splashed on the  coachman."

Funny how we now abbreviate "dashboard" to "dash". Isn't language interesting!

MikeSimon

  • Full Member
  • Platinum
  • ******
  • USA, OH, North Royalton
  • Posts: 2477
Re: Another "Identify" Please
« Reply #7 on: February 27, 2020, 13:08:30 »
We have the "different term" thread of the English language elsewhere and it is indeed interesting. Speaking two languages quite fluently and another two to get around as a tourist, I am always intrigued by words, their use and their origin. I also found that many people have their own preference of using a particular word as opposed to another one, depending on the environment they are in, whether that is a geographical area, work or hobby. Point in case: dash or dashboard. I never use it. I always use "instrument panel". 8)
1970/71 280SL Automatic
Sandy Beige
Parchment Leather
Power Steering
Automatic
Hardtop
Heated Tinted Rear Window
German specs
3rd owner

stickandrudderman

  • Vendor
  • Platinum
  • ******
  • United Kingdom, England, Richmond
  • Posts: 2924
    • http://www.colinferns.com
Re: Another "Identify" Please
« Reply #8 on: February 27, 2020, 16:07:44 »
Instrument panels are found in aeroplanes!

Tyler S

  • Associate Member
  • Platinum
  • ******
  • USA, CA, Encinitas
  • Posts: 1613
Re: Another "Identify" Please
« Reply #9 on: February 27, 2020, 17:31:02 »
dash·board
/ˈdaSHbôrd/
 
noun
1.
the panel facing the driver of a vehicle or the pilot of an aircraft, containing instruments and controls.
2.
HISTORICAL
a board of wood or leather in front of a carriage, to keep out mud.
1968 (67) 250sl. 4 speed manual. DB180 Silver
1955 220 Cabriolet A. White Grey
2019 E450 Wagon. Majestic Blue
1936 Ford PU Flathead V8. Creme on tan interior.
1989 Volkswagen T3 Westfailia Campmobile. Dove Grey (blue)

ja17

  • Full Member
  • Platinum
  • ******
  • USA, OH, Blacklick
  • Posts: 7414
Re: Another "Identify" Please
« Reply #10 on: February 28, 2020, 04:38:09 »
Stick, the Wiki describes a "screw" as a threaded fastener which creates its own threads, whereas a bolt uses pre-cut threads.  Now it also states that it is common for the manufacturers and end users to mix and deviate from these descriptions at least with our SAE standards. "All thread" is a term more often used to describe threaded rod in the USA. To be technically correct I guess I would have to describe the fastener as a "fully threaded bolt" (USA). In some ways the bolt pictured looks like it could be SAE and not metric? I would not be surprised if the DIN specifications and descriptions are more defined and precise as far as the differences of "screws and bolts"?

"I'm going to take the torch to the car since the light is out in the boot". (Americans might think your going to set the car on fire since the trunk light is not working!)

 Americans say "I'm going to take the flashlight to the car since the light in my trunk is not working"

Language and translation is not a perfect science and the above examples are both from English speaking countries.

Joe Alexander
Blacklick, Ohio
1969 Dark Olive 280SL
2002 ML55 AMG (tow vehicle)
2002 SLK32 AMG (350 hp)
1982 300TD Wagon turbo 4spd.
1963 404 Mercedes Unimog (Swedish Army)
1989 flu419 Mercedes Unimog (US Army)
1998 E430
1974 450SLC Rally
1965 220SE Finback

Pawel66

  • Full Member
  • Platinum
  • ******
  • Poland, Mazowieckie, Konstancin-Jeziorna
  • Posts: 5494
Re: Another "Identify" Please
« Reply #11 on: February 28, 2020, 07:04:57 »
Stick, the Wiki describes a "screw" as a threaded fastener which creates its own threads, whereas a bolt uses pre-cut threads. 

That is what I thought it was!

But then native speakers here on the Forum did not use it this way and called fasteners using pre-cut threads "screws" as well....
Pawel

280SL 1970 automatic 180G Silver
W128 220SE
W121 190SL
G-class

stickandrudderman

  • Vendor
  • Platinum
  • ******
  • United Kingdom, England, Richmond
  • Posts: 2924
    • http://www.colinferns.com
Re: Another "Identify" Please
« Reply #12 on: February 28, 2020, 10:35:49 »
I like this discussion!
A "set screw" is a fully threaded bolt whereas a "self tapping screw" is a tapered screw designed to be inserted into a hole in thin sheet.
I once had a "Eureka" moment when an idea popped into my head for a self-taping screw that had it's own drill tip so you could drill and insert the screw in one action. I thought I would be set for life with this invention. It turned out they already existed and are called "Tek screws".  :-\


MikeSimon

  • Full Member
  • Platinum
  • ******
  • USA, OH, North Royalton
  • Posts: 2477
Re: Another "Identify" Please
« Reply #13 on: February 28, 2020, 18:21:32 »
Aren't we Germans lucky! 8) Whether it is a bolt or a screw, we call it just "Schraube". That's,by the way,what all the threaded fasteners on the Pagodas are: "Schrauben"!
Zylinderkopfschrauben, Ölwannenschrauben, Kotflügelschrauben, Blechschrauben, Einstellschrauben and, I bet, even some Holzschrauben somewhere! ;)
1970/71 280SL Automatic
Sandy Beige
Parchment Leather
Power Steering
Automatic
Hardtop
Heated Tinted Rear Window
German specs
3rd owner

Cees Klumper

  • Full Member
  • Platinum
  • ******
  • USA, CA, Fallbrook
  • Posts: 5719
    • http://SL113.org
Re: Another "Identify" Please
« Reply #14 on: February 28, 2020, 19:27:05 »
I am sorry but did we ever figure out and agree the actual answer to the question?!
I thought about a bracket when I saw the 'thing' myself.
We do have a great capacity to veer off-topic!
Cees Klumper
1969 Mercedes 280 SL automatic
1968 Ford Mustang 302 V8
1961 Alfa Romeo Giulietta Sprint Coupe 1600
1962 FIAT 1500S OSCA convertible
1972 Lancia Fulvia Coupe 1.3
1983 Porsche 944 2.5
1990 Ford Bronco II

MikeSimon

  • Full Member
  • Platinum
  • ******
  • USA, OH, North Royalton
  • Posts: 2477
Re: Another "Identify" Please
« Reply #15 on: February 28, 2020, 21:03:01 »
Some dimensions would probably help to narrow it down: length, hex size and thread diameter?
1970/71 280SL Automatic
Sandy Beige
Parchment Leather
Power Steering
Automatic
Hardtop
Heated Tinted Rear Window
German specs
3rd owner

Benz Dr.

  • Associate Member
  • Platinum
  • ******
  • Canada, ON, Port Lambton
  • Posts: 7220
  • Benz Dr.
Re: Another "Identify" Please
« Reply #16 on: February 28, 2020, 22:25:07 »
Aren't we Germans lucky! 8) Whether it is a bolt or a screw, we call it just "Schraube". That's,by the way,what all the threaded fasteners on the Pagodas are: "Schrauben"!
Zylinderkopfschrauben, Ölwannenschrauben, Kotflügelschrauben, Blechschrauben, Einstellschrauben and, I bet, even some Holzschrauben somewhere! ;)

Never to be confused with a holtzenconfloppen.
1966 230SL 5 speed, LSD, header pipes, 300SE distributor, ported, polished and balanced, AKA  ''The Red Rocket ''
Dan Caron's SL Barn

1970  3.5 Coupe
1961  190SL
1985   300CD  Turbo Coupe
1981  300SD
2013  GMC  Sierra
1965  230SL
1967 250SL
1970 280SL
1988 560SEC

Shvegel

  • Inactive
  • Platinum
  • ******
  • USA, OH, Cleveland Heights
  • Posts: 2978
Re: Another "Identify" Please
« Reply #17 on: February 29, 2020, 00:07:02 »
All debate aside a picture of the head end would be helpful.  That way we can tell if it is metric or SAE thread.

Harry

  • Full Member
  • Gold
  • *****
  • USA, TN, Knoxville
  • Posts: 742
Re: Another "Identify" Please
« Reply #18 on: March 02, 2020, 17:09:39 »
Sure - I'll get that tonight.  I tend to recall that Joe was correct about the possibility of it being a bolt/screw for the A/C bracket.

And yes - WAY off topic! :)
Harry Bailey
Knoxville, TN
1966 230SL
Automatic

John Betsch - "SADIE"

  • Pagoda SL Board
  • Silver
  • ****
  • USA, NY, SOUTHOLD
  • Posts: 403
Re: Another "Identify" Please
« Reply #19 on: March 02, 2020, 19:07:04 »
Thought I would add to this interesting language discussion  Below (sorry abut the caps) are some words on a sign when my car is shown  It is interesting the reactions I get:

ALLES TOURISTEN AND NON-TECHNISCHEN LOKKENS PEEPERS

DAS 1965 ROT. MET. MACHINE IS NICHT FUR FINGERPOKEN UND
MITTENGRABBEN.

ODERWISE, IS EASY SCHAPPEN DER SPROGGENWERK,
BLOWNFUSE, UND POPPERCORKEN MIT SPITZENSPARKEN.

DER MACHINE IS DIGGEN BY EXPERTEN ONLY.
IS NICHT FUR GERVERKEN BY DAS DUMKOPFEN.

RUBBERNEKEN, SIGHTSEENEN, IS PERMITTEN, BUT KEEPEN DAS
COTTENPICKEN HANDS IN DAS POCKETS


SO RELAXEN UND WATCHEN DAS VUNDERBAR MACHINE.
[/center][/center]

JB
« Last Edit: March 02, 2020, 20:48:40 by SADIE »
JB; 1965 German market SL, Rot Met 571, Summary Code 213 Interior

MikeSimon

  • Full Member
  • Platinum
  • ******
  • USA, OH, North Royalton
  • Posts: 2477
Re: Another "Identify" Please
« Reply #20 on: March 02, 2020, 19:08:08 »
You can take the bolt/screw to almost any hardware store and check the threads on a "thread checker' board to determine category and size.
1970/71 280SL Automatic
Sandy Beige
Parchment Leather
Power Steering
Automatic
Hardtop
Heated Tinted Rear Window
German specs
3rd owner

ejboyd5

  • Associate Member
  • Gold
  • *****
  • Southold, NY
  • Posts: 510
Re: Another "Identify" Please
« Reply #21 on: March 02, 2020, 20:11:49 »
A "motor" is powered by electricity, which has already been converted to a source of energy by an engine using a raw fuel.  An "engine" is a device that makes energy from a raw fuel through a process of heat or combustion or from a raw fuel such as wind or water that has been harnessed to provide a rotational force to something such as a turbine.