Author Topic: Valuation of a '68 What's your guess?  (Read 6460 times)

Garry

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Re: Valuation of a '68 What's your guess?
« Reply #25 on: January 05, 2022, 01:19:31 »
Good outcome Ray.

Hopefully the buyer will in time come on board with the Group and show us what the end result is for the car.

Garry
Garry Marks
Melbourne/ Kyneton, Brisbane. Australia
1969 MB 280SL 5 speed RHD SOLD.
1965 MB 230SL Auto RHD Lt Blue 334G, Top 350H, Tourist Delivery.
1972 MB 280CE Auto RHD 906G
2005 MB A200
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johnk

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Re: Valuation of a '68 What's your guess?
« Reply #26 on: January 05, 2022, 01:57:11 »
Curious
What would be the cost of a complete engine transmission and rear end rebuild? $25k?  A barely noticeable rust job upon purchase like Shvegels would have to cost what, $50 to $75k.

I would not be surprised that the 280 that recently sold on eBay for $110k could end up in this high range to fix the surprise rust.
John Krystowski
Avon Ohio
1968 Euro 280sl under restoration
2016 Jag F-Type R sold june 2021
1950 Alfa Romeo 6C 2500 SS For sale
2008 E350
2007 GL 450
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Benz Dr.

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Re: Valuation of a '68 What's your guess?
« Reply #27 on: January 05, 2022, 07:10:20 »
Curious
What would be the cost of a complete engine transmission and rear end rebuild? $25k?  A barely noticeable rust job upon purchase like Shvegels would have to cost what, $50 to $75k.

I would not be surprised that the 280 that recently sold on eBay for $110k could end up in this high range to fix the surprise rust.

You might be able to do those jobs for less and it's possible to find good used units for less than half that amount - it would be rare to find a car that needed all three rebuilds all at the same time. Despite contrary notions, a rust free body is still far better find than a car needing all of the above. Rear axles, properly cared for, last almost forever. Transmissions will easily go for 150K if serviced properly. Engines usually run at least 120K but can go longer. All of these things depend on regular service and all are based upon cars from when they were new. Lots of our cars saw year round use and many saw use in winter with salty roads ruining a lot of them.
 Motor mounts? Yeah, they wear out. So do brake pads, fan belts, tires, and most any part made of rubber. I had to replace my MC and sub frame mounts last year but then they probably had 20 years of use so I wasn't surprised because I used my car a lot during most of those years. We have many products today that are far better then they were in the 60's. Paint, lubricants, lead free fuels, car care products, and for the most part, better roads ( at least where I live ).

 Today, few cars see year round use and most are used lightly only in summer weather. Living in a mild or dry climate, or summer driving, can add years to the body work of your car and so too for mechanical things.


   
1966 230SL 5 speed, LSD, header pipes, 300SE distributor, ported, polished and balanced, AKA  ''The Red Rocket ''
Dan Caron's SL Barn

1970  3.5 Coupe
1961  190SL
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1967 250SL
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john.mancini

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Re: Valuation of a '68 What's your guess?
« Reply #28 on: January 05, 2022, 11:42:57 »
Dan is correct, and my point was that a complete engine/transmission rebuild could cost much less than restoring the body of a car with rust or accident issues. This does not mean that someone should abandon a full body and paint restoration on a W113, it simply means that you could be in for some financial surprises. Complete engine rebuilds have a fairly accurate cost estimate going in to the project. Rust doesn't. 
John
65 230SL 519 Red 4-sp
98 911 cab
56 Ford F100
08 Porsche RS60 Spyder
23 Z4M40i

Leester

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Re: Valuation of a '68 What's your guess?
« Reply #29 on: January 05, 2022, 14:12:25 »


I am retired and when this car is finished, I plan to drive it. Everyday if I can. Well maybe not everyday but a lot. So I wanted to get it to the point where there were no major surprises and unknown frustrations. I do expect some small surprises but am confident that with my wrenching skills and help from Pagoda Group members - which has been indispensable - I can resolve any issues that arise. I also hate leaks so that figured into some of my decisions.

In my recent experience the cost of rust repair and paint was about double the cost of rebuilt engine (Metric), rebuilt trans and rebuilt rear end. Most likely the trans and rear end were fine but in the case of the rear end it is a 3.27 and I really didn't know its condition so I elected the rebuild. I also bought the Rhode Island Wiring harness (sorry L Peterson - I didn't know about you at the time) and transferred over the connectors. I rebuilt the brake calipers but installed new brake and clutch master cylinders. The costs do mount up.

Unlike my wrenching skills, I have absolutely no skills in body work. If I could do what Cees does, maybe I could have brought down the cost of bodywork - but I don't. Did I overdo? Maybe but I am getting what I want.

But yes, in my case the cost of the body work was a lot and did come as a surprise.

Lee Backus
1963 220SE Cabriolet
1970 280SL (reassembling - hopefully soon)
1978 450SL (disassembled for paint)
1985 500SEC

Cees Klumper

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Re: Valuation of a '68 What's your guess?
« Reply #30 on: January 05, 2022, 18:39:02 »
Thanks for the mention Leester!

Bodywork, rust repairs, it's specialized work like most work on cars. This past weekend, I painted my son's Datsun 240Z and it came out great, like the Lancia did. Getting the hang of painting but have to say, if a 61 year old accountant like myself can do this after just watching a bunch of youtube videos and doing some basic research, so can most people. As I reported before, I am painting in my 2-car garage with second hand compressor and fan, and maybe $350 in miscellaneous lumber, screws, plastic and other supplies. The gallon 2K urethane paint for the Datsun came to less than $200 and it's stunning. I did have to do various typical rust repairs to the rockers, floors, rear hatch and fenders. With only one year of experience, a basic welder, very basic tools and some sheet metal, I can now do such repairs invisibly and solidly. So, in my experience, it's not complicated or hard, but it is very time-consuming and, at $50-100 an hour, that is what adds up quickly. And of course in Mercedes' case the cost of replacement panels.

I am currently rebuilding my Lancia engine. Some work will be done by a machine shop but the rest (dismantling, checking condition, deciding what needs doing, and re-assembly) I am doing myself. The engine is in good shape, but I am replacing all valves, springs and seals, piston rings and connecting rod bearings but all that is coming to less than $800 in parts and outsourced work. The whole rebuild will be around $1,200 maybe and if I would have had to get new pistons + overboring, add maybe $800. A Pagoda engine rebuild does not have to cost much more, if you do the work yourself.

But, like anything, get it done by a professional and the costs will add up very quickly. I still do think that, depending on the extent of rust, that can be far more costly than mechanical repairs, as most others here have commented.

Cees Klumper
1969 Mercedes 280 SL automatic
1968 Ford Mustang 302 V8
1961 Alfa Romeo Giulietta Sprint Coupe 1600
1962 FIAT 1500S OSCA convertible
1972 Lancia Fulvia Coupe 1.3
1983 Porsche 944 2.5
1990 Ford Bronco II

john.mancini

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Re: Valuation of a '68 What's your guess?
« Reply #31 on: January 06, 2022, 00:02:01 »
It would be very interesting to follow the pending restoration, in detail, on this 280SL. Congrats on the sale.
John
65 230SL 519 Red 4-sp
98 911 cab
56 Ford F100
08 Porsche RS60 Spyder
23 Z4M40i

Tycoon

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Re: Valuation of a '68 What's your guess?
« Reply #32 on: January 06, 2022, 18:04:05 »
It would be nice to provide a price range on the sale, ie; $30-$40, $40-$50, etc. as to give the members a range of current market value, for a similar vehicle outside of the crazy auction sites……this has left everyone following this post without closure!

Bill

GM

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Re: Valuation of a '68 What's your guess?
« Reply #33 on: January 06, 2022, 20:20:31 »
I sold my 1971 280SL (US) last weekend.

Unfortunately, it was not my intent to sell, but "life happens" and I had to move on.

I debated on doing BaT but, as someone in the group once commented, I didn't want to subject myself to a colonoscopy by Pagoda wannabe amateurs. And many of the recent postings for Pagodas on BaT didn't reach the reserve. I think our cars are for the unique collector who knows what they want, and knows these cars. One potential buyer commented that these cars sell for much more in Europe than in the U.S.

Another potential buyer had a thorough, professional inspection on the car (2 1/2 hours) with the result deeming my car a 2-3 condition; not original engine (but legit 280, M130), filled in headlight/fender notches, noticeable body work that partially filled in the fender spot welds on one side, dated external chrome, original carpet and (dented) aluminum door sills, etc. A good (what I would consider very good) driver.

The car sold for in the $80-90k range, which I can live with. I figured the next level of pricing over $100k gets into full restoration territory, which I wasn't going to do - wasn't going to be cost effective - and I wanted a driver anyway, not one I'd be afraid to drive.

I want to thank this fantastic group of helpful, selfless individuals from around the world, who have given me much help and support during the last 2 years of my Pagoda ownership; I will miss you all.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2022, 21:03:10 by GM »
Gary
1971 280SL - Sold
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johnk

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Re: Valuation of a '68 What's your guess?
« Reply #34 on: January 07, 2022, 01:14:28 »
Sounds like you got a good price gary
John Krystowski
Avon Ohio
1968 Euro 280sl under restoration
2016 Jag F-Type R sold june 2021
1950 Alfa Romeo 6C 2500 SS For sale
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Shvegel

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Re: Valuation of a '68 What's your guess?
« Reply #35 on: January 07, 2022, 10:03:22 »
Gary,
You will be missed. 

Garry

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Re: Valuation of a '68 What's your guess?
« Reply #36 on: January 07, 2022, 10:41:58 »
Gary,

Sorry to see that you have sold your car and backing away from the Forum. Of course you are welcome to remain lurking, you have been a good contributor to the Group during your ownership.

Best wishes in your next adventure.

Garry
Garry Marks
Melbourne/ Kyneton, Brisbane. Australia
1969 MB 280SL 5 speed RHD SOLD.
1965 MB 230SL Auto RHD Lt Blue 334G, Top 350H, Tourist Delivery.
1972 MB 280CE Auto RHD 906G
2005 MB A200
2006 MB B200
2019 Izuzu DMax 4x4 Slide-on camper.
2022 Volvo XC40 Electric
2024 Volvo EX30 Electric

Mike Hughes

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Re: Valuation of a '68 What's your guess?
« Reply #37 on: January 07, 2022, 12:46:29 »
Of course you are welcome to remain lurking, you have been a good contributor to the Group during your ownership.

I'll second that.  I am a member of at least two marque organizations for vehicles I don't or didn't have.  I am still a member of the North American MMM Register, even though I sold my '34 M.G. L1 Magna Salonette to fund the purchase of my Pagoda nearly two decades ago.  It's a good group of enthusiasts and I enjoy reading about the gatherings or newest restoration project of one of these remarkable pre-war M.G.s.  In 1975 I was a founding member of the North American MGA register, even though I didn't own an MGA!  After 46 years of membership I finally acquired my first MGA, a '61 1600 Coupe, in October.
- Mike Hughes  -ô¿ô-
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GM

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Re: Valuation of a '68 What's your guess?
« Reply #38 on: January 07, 2022, 16:38:55 »
Thanks Pat and Garry.
And yes, I do plan to continue lurking... ;)
Gary
1971 280SL - Sold
(98 from the end of production)
DB180 Silver Gray Metallic
Black MB Tex

chumps

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Re: Valuation of a '68 What's your guess?
« Reply #39 on: January 10, 2022, 21:03:51 »
GM - I'm sorry that you had to sell your car. I have a very nice 1971 280 SL that I have had for 24 years. I'm the third owner. I think I might be selling it sometime this year. The car is excellent, body wise and mechanical wise. How did you go about selling your car? Like you, I don't want to put it on BaT because I have no experience with auctions. But I would like it to be exposed to buyers that are very familiar these cars and will know a good car when see one. I'm sure this club would be a great place to start. Thank you for any information on the subject.

GM

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Re: Valuation of a '68 What's your guess?
« Reply #40 on: January 10, 2022, 21:57:01 »
I listed it on Hemmings.com and got good traffic. Still had to sort out through the tire-kickers, lowballers, and lookie loos.
PM me and I'm happy to discuss with you.
Gary
Gary
1971 280SL - Sold
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DB180 Silver Gray Metallic
Black MB Tex

114015

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Re: Valuation of a '68 What's your guess?
« Reply #41 on: January 10, 2022, 22:59:06 »

Hello Gary,

Very sorry to hear you parted with your SL. But this is how live goes.
Sometime in the future everybody of us will part with his/her SL ...

Yes, please stay with the group (as an associate member) and say 'hi' from time to time.

All best,

Achim

Achim
(Germany)

GM

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Re: Valuation of a '68 What's your guess?
« Reply #42 on: January 11, 2022, 00:10:39 »
Thank you, Achim.
Definitely planned on having the car longer than I did.
I will definitely chime in if I can help - that's been the best thing about owning the car - the helpful attitude of everyone in the Group, and the desire to help others.
Gary
1971 280SL - Sold
(98 from the end of production)
DB180 Silver Gray Metallic
Black MB Tex

chumps

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Re: Valuation of a '68 What's your guess?
« Reply #43 on: January 11, 2022, 16:14:23 »
GM - thank you for response. Chumps