Summer #3 Of Restoration

[Sphe]

Well it's summer again for me, and so I thought I'd start my log back up. For those of you who don't know, I'll catch you up. My previous thread "Restoration Has Begun!" gives the details. My dad and I are restoring his 1965 230sl. We've cleaned it up, got the motor to turn over with the starter, done some serious body work, and cleaned and sludged the tank. This is where we are now. Our strategy is as follows (comments & suggestions always welcome!)

1) Attach tank to car
2) Fill tank with gas
3) Turn key
4) See what happens...

If everything starts up ok, we figure we'll tune the linkages a little bit, but then get to work on the brakes... cause they are non existant. Goal for the end of the summer is to be able to get this puppy moving safely! (aka being able to stop)

Eugene
1965 230SL, Max Speed: Zero

[Jonny B]

You may want to consider having the fuel tank relined. You can use the search feature to find out more information about what others have done in this regard. This will ensure the tank stays in good shape in the interior. There are all kinds of gremlins that can crop up from small particles of stuff in the fuel tank.

Jonny B
1967 250SL Auto

[Sphe]

Thanks for the tip! However we did already line the tank. And you are right, it was amazing what kind of debris came out of that thing.

Eugene
1965 230SL, Max Speed: Zero

[Jonny B]

Another fuel related item, is to make sure all the vent lines by the filler neck or clean and open, including the metal pipes, and connectors hoses. There are plenty of strings on that on the site, just use the search feature to pick them up, try fuel odor, gas odor, or similar

Jonny B
1967 250SL Auto

[Sphe]

I think it's time... If the weather's good this evening and things go smoothly we're throwin on the tank, hooking everything up, putting some gas in, and turning the key. We'll see what happens. Hopefully nothing will blow up.

Eugene
1965 230SL, Max Speed: Zero

[Cees Klumper]

Before you do this, I suggest turning the engine by hand a few revolutions to make sure engine timing is not a potential problem (if it was possibly altered). Good luck, hope it's one of those "only took two turns before she fired right up!"

Cees ("Case") Klumper in Amsterdam
'69 white 280 SL automatic

[Sphe]

I've turned the engine by hand before a few times, even with the starter motor. Everything sounded really good. How would i tell if the timing was altered?

Anywhoo, didn't get to the point to get it started. Got the tank on, and connected all the hoses. But the fuel sender was a little rusty, and we decided to put a little time into cleaning that up really nice. And we needed to put the fuel screen in the bottom of the tank and we accidently painted the bolt shut (damn). So once we open that up we'll be good to go. I estimate 1 or 2 more evenings of work. It should be started within the week! Possibly monday!

Eugene
1965 230SL, Max Speed: Zero

[Cees Klumper]

I was just concerned that the engine timing (movement of pistons and valves etc) could be out of whack. Sounds like that is not an issue. Good luck on getting it running, a very exciting couple of seconds that will be.

Cees ("Case") Klumper in Amsterdam
'69 white 280 SL automatic

[Sphe]

Someone once told me I should make a gas/oil mixture for the first start up... should I really do this? Is it ok not to? and what exactly does it do?

Eugene
1965 230SL, Max Speed: Zero

[Naj ✝︎]

Hi, Eugene,
Check this:

http://index.php?topic=1979,additives

naj

65 230SL
68 280SL

[Sphe]

From what I undesrtand from that link, that our man Rodd doesn't suggest putting oil in the tank. So I'm thinkin that I dont need to...

Eugene
1965 230SL, Max Speed: Zero

[Cees Klumper]

No need to indeed. Just make sure your oil pressure pegs (goes to the maximum value on the dial) when it starts running.

Cees ("Case") Klumper in Amsterdam
'69 white 280 SL automatic

[Sphe]

Well. I'm still alive.

We filled the tank with 2&1/2 gallons of premium gas. Turned the key. The starter was turning the engine over but the engine wasn't firing. We tried this a few times. Depressing the gas pedal while starting didn't do anything. Car was turning over beautifully with the starter ). But having the gas tank and everything hooked up hasn't changed anything so far. We're planning on looking into the distributor cap making sure everything is clean and such. What else should we look into? One major thing im curious about is if gas is getting to the engine. How do we test that? Did I even put enough gas in?

Eugene
1965 230SL, Max Speed: Zero

[Sphe]

And a sidenote, the car will start if the linkages are a little out of wack right? or at least I'll notice that the car is getting gas... cause it's possible the linkages aren't in the write positions.

Eugene
1965 230SL, Max Speed: Zero

[Cees Klumper]

The owners manual indicates that if the tank was allowed to go empty, you need to put n an appreciable amount of gas to enable the car to start. I don't have the exact quantity handy, but I would go ahead and put in maybe 10 gallons.
Sometimes cracking the fuel lines at the injectors makes it easier for the gas to reach them ('bleeding the lines'). This way you will be able to tell whether gas is getting to the injectors. You should check to see whether you have a spark: take one spark plug off, put it on a spare splug and while cranking, hold that against earth to see whether it sparks. Are you sure the timing is correct?

Cees ("Case") Klumper in Amsterdam
'69 white 280 SL automatic

[Sphe]

Well.
put 6 gallons in. It was recommended in the manual to put in at least 4. And still nothing. We took the hose off the output of the gas pump. Tried running it. Nothing. Hose to the pump has plenty of gas in it.
Uh oh.
Frozen fuel pump.

Eugene
1965 230SL, Max Speed: Zero

[Ben]

Is the pump wired the right way, the polarity may have been reversed !

I assume the pumps runs ? You can hear it hiss with the ignition on ?

Regards,
Ben in Ireland.
'64 230SL 4sp.

[Sphe]

Unfortunately no. There's no hiss. And im assuming, since the pump worked fine last time it ran (8 years ago) the polarity should be fine. The pump doesn't make any noise.

Eugene
1965 230SL, Max Speed: Zero

[rwmastel]

quote:Originally posted by Sphe

Unfortunately no. There's no hiss. And im assuming, since the pump worked fine last time it ran (8 years ago) the polarity should be fine. The pump doesn't make any noise.

Search this site for "rebuild fuel pump".  You shouldn't have to spend too much money.

Rodd
Powell, Ohio, USA
1966 230SL, Euro, Auto, Leather, both  tops
1994 E420

[hands_aus]

what about the pump fuse?

number 4 I think, checked that?

Bob Smith (Brisbane,Australia)
RHD,1967 early 250 SL, auto

[Sphe]

Im sure that's good, power was going to the pump.

Eugene
1965 230SL, Max Speed: Zero

[mdsalemi]

Maybe JA or The Doc can weigh in on this one...I seem to remember something that someone once told me about having to reset a fuel pump?  That something inside needs to be reset if certain conditions existe(d) and it can mimic a dead fuel pump?  Because I suffered some fuel related issues (not the pump, however) this came up...Of course I could be dreaming...

Michael Salemi
1969 280SL
Signal Red w/Black Leather
Restored

[Naj ✝︎]

Eugene,
If you've got power at the pump and its not humming, it may be best to take it off and remove the bottom cover to have a look. The impellor may have seized up.
There is a filter screen in the inlet pipe adaptor and a one way valve on the outlet. These should be cleaned up too if you go this far.

naj

65 230SL
68 280SL

[hands_aus]

Eugene,
Is the pump the large OLD style pump or the small New style pump? They look similar but the new pump has the outlet pipe pointing almost vertically while the old style pump has the outlet pipe almost horizontal.

Normally you can hear the pump motor spinning.

I see you are sure there is voltage to the pump. If the brushes are worn out there will be no circuit through the pump.

The fuel pumps can be rebuilt. I have only done the large old style pump but George Des on here has rebuilt many new pumps.

On the inlet side of the pump there is a fine mesh filter and on the outlet side is a non return valve.
The filter can become badly blocked and not allow much fuel to pass.
It can be cleaned without having to remove it from the pump itself.
If the rubber pipe from the tank to the pump inlet is not horizontal (with no sagging) the pump will have trouble priming.

Bob Smith (Brisbane,Australia)
RHD,1967 early 250 SL, auto

[Sphe]

We have checked the contacts of the pump. There is definitely power to the pump, and no hum. The pump did warm up when we were trying to start the car. It actually got quite hot. Which gets me thinking there's a motor try to move an impeller that's seized. Our local mechanic says it might be possible to free the impeller my taking a hammer and tapping the fuel pump to free up some debris, and I have emailed George Des on trying to take it apart and free up the insides.
We'll try the tapping thing today, and if that doesn't work, we'll try to take the bottom plate off, hoping the bolts aren't frozen as well.

Eugene
1965 230SL, Max Speed: Zero