Road trip west, questions for you all.

[Ed Riefstahl]

Greetings Pagoda friends,

This may not be the proper category for this topic, but starting here.
While recovering from cancer in 2022 & 23, my wife's one request was to take Ms Magoo (our 1966 Pagoda) on another trip to Canyon Lands area in Utah. She is doing fantastic now, and it looks like we're finally going to be able to make the trip in mid / late July.

We will be driving mostly secondary roads from North Western PA through the center of the country to Colorado, Utah, Wyoming area etc. We have no set route or agenda and will travel as much or as little as we feel up to each day. In June / July 2014 we took a 7000 mile road trip to San Francisco in Ms Magoo. We're 10 years older, so is our car, and our SL has no AC. So this is something for us to consider when it comes to some of the lower states.

Our question to you all is, what to see? We've been to most of the main attractions. However, we haven't driven up to Pikes Peak. Has anyone on this list driven it? Would you recommend it in a 58 year old car?

We're interested in hearing about some of the out of the way places that are less publicized. We sure would like to know of some of the places that you would say "if you're in the area, don't miss"?

Thanks, we hope to hear of some really cool places.

Kind regards,
Ed & Clover Riefstahl
Erie, PA

1966 230SL (Ms Magoo) Horizon Blue
1970 280S (Miss Daisy)
1999 BMW Z3 5 speed
1991 BMW 318I 5 Speed
1997 Toyota Paseo Convertible - One of 1000, (have you ever seen one?)
1997 Ford Ranger step side (Mater)
2023 Mazda CX 5

[zoegrlh]

Years ago drove up Pikes Peak in a 65 GTO, was no problem then and with that car. I CD would not suggest you taking a Pagoda up, unless you have never had any overheating issues. What happens is that you drive up so slow the engine will heat up. Along the way up at intervals are water stops for your radiator. Another issue is the way back down, the Park Service checks your brakes for proper fluid level. So these water stops are also for cooling your brakes, by spraying them with cool water. Anyway take a coat with you too. We went up it in the month of July, 80 degrees at bottom, right at freezing at top. Have fun, sounds like a nice adventure.

[Ed Riefstahl]

Hi Robert,

Thanks for the heads-up. I think we're going to pass on driving Ms Magoo up to Pikes Peak. It appears you now need reservations anyway, even to drive your own car up. I guess I'm loosing my nerve a little.

In 2014 we wanted to drive our Pagoda across The Golden Gate Bridge. On our return trip East, we decided (with some encouragement), to drive across the state of Nevada and Utah on RT 50 (named The Loneliest Highway in America). Very remote, but an absolutely wonderful top-down drive through the canyons. We eventually caught I-70 and drove up the 13,000 ft. incline to Denver. i think that drive on Rt 50 and the Tail of The Dragon in Tennessee are two of our most memorable drives in our SL.

We just celebrated our 48th anniversary yesterday. Our favorite way to celebrate our anniversary, is find a road we've never been on before. We've often pointed the car in a certain direction and started driving, usually in a convertible.

We're sure hoping to get some ideas from other folks. So many cool places to see.

Ed Riefstahl
Erie, PA

1966 230SL (Ms Magoo) Horizon Blue
1970 280S (Miss Daisy)
1999 BMW Z3 5 speed
1991 BMW 318I 5 Speed
1997 Toyota Paseo Convertible - One of 1000, (have you ever seen one?)
1997 Ford Ranger step side (Mater)
2023 Mazda CX 5

[roymil]

I think thats a great idea, but you do have to prepare, and I mean very seriously prepare for any trip to canyon country, regardless of vehicle.  I've been all over that area many times and I've learned what can happen.  Google Utah state scenic highway 12.  Best paved road in the universe, ok, maybe just behind California highway 1 around Big Sur.

I always pack and plan as if I am going to breakdown for sure in Utah and will need to have all the water, food, shelter, first aid, and anything else we might need to survive for 48hrs minimum with no support and no cell coverage (canyons can block most signals).  You have to assume tow service is 8+ hrs out, after you figure out who and how to contact...and they charge hefty surcharges.  Rangers in any of the many state and national parks will not rescue or tow you unless you are in physical danger.   They will give you water and maybe pass a message for you via radio, oh, and they will call Kanab district station and get a helicopter out looking for your dead body.  ask me how I know ;-)

It is very remote and sparsely populated region, and honestly, July is not the preferred time to visit because of the heat, you wont see as many people as in the Spring, which is peak season. Fall is risky due to flood danger.   2 inches of rain there is like 15 inches anywhere else because it doesn't soak in, it runs into the washes and canyons and fills them up in a "flash", literally, and those canyon floors are where they built a lot of the roads by the way, so its guite common to run across mud covering paved backroads after any rain.  The last flash flood I witnessed came from a rain storm 10 miles away, we never saw the rain and were fortunate to escape to a high spot.

I cant emphasize enough the need to carry lots of water anywhere in the desert southwest.  You need to carry a couple gallons of water per person at all times (maybe more for the pagoda?) and have everything you need to survive overnight in case you break down and can't get help right away.  There are many areas with no cell coverage at all so I'd think it worth the investment in the latest i-phone with the ability for emergency calls via satellite.  There are many remote areas and services are few and far between, and I'm not just talking about backroads, even US interstate I-70 has a 109 mile stretch over the San Rafael Swell with absolutely no services, no people, just nothing but the most amazing views you can imagine.  Maybe 1 trooper looping the route every few hours.

I was raised in Vegas and went to university in Utah and have taken many trips all over southern utah, having had more than one breakdown in my old jeep.  It is my favorite place on the planet and by far among the most beautiful places you can go, but it is also among the most dangerous places for a road trip.   I have been humbled more than once there.  I've had rangers looking for my body after a flash flood, I've overheated and blown hoses, high-centered and ruptured a gas tank,  and I've ran out of water once and was only saved by an old guy stopping to give us some ice cold beers, which have interesting effects on the dehydrated body BTW.   

Sorry for the paranoid sounding warnings but I truly have scars from some of my adventures down there...and I cant wait to go back !

When you go , state highway 12 is a must see, one end to the other, lower speed, 2 lanes, all paved , lots of twisty turns, multiple parks,  its all amazing.  It gets a fair bit of traffic so unlikely you will be more than a few hours from help at any point.   That would be the best route for a pagoda with top down and lots of sunscreen.

https://www.utah.com/things-to-do/scenic-drives/highway-12-scenic-byway/

the first picture is highway 12 neer Capitol Reef National Park.   The second picure is a road inside Zion national park. In late summer to fall expect afternoon/evening pop up showers.

thanks!  I now need to plan my next trip there, not with pagoda, but with fully equipped 4-runner,  so far into the back-country nobody will find the body ;-)

[Ed Riefstahl]

Thanks Mark, All good advice.

You're right, absolutely beautiful country. We've actually driven through these areas a number of times in a convertible, and from Bar Harbor to Florida twice and coast to coast in our Pagoda. We've racked up over 60,000 miles on our SL traveling the back roads of America, one mile at a time.

However we are getting older and more cautious, and plan to stick closer to civilization this trip. I did spend the last 2 years going through our SL, front to back. I even carry a spare fuel pump.

We always carry a couple days food and water with us. Back when I traveled cross country on bicycle with my father, food & water was a major concern. You can only carry so much stuff on a bicycle. No cell phones or GPS in those days either. We sure got used to drinking warm water, bathing in creeks and sleeping wherever.

Thanks for the tips. We're still hoping for some interesting, less known places to check out on our way to or from.

PS: If it's too hot for us, we will likely head north to the Dakota's.

Ed Riefstahl
Erie, PA

1966 230SL (Ms Magoo) Horizon Blue
1970 280S (Miss Daisy)
1999 BMW Z3 5 speed
1991 BMW 318I 5 Speed
1997 Toyota Paseo Convertible - One of 1000, (have you ever seen one?)
1997 Ford Ranger step side (Mater)
2023 Mazda CX 5

[John Betsch - "SADIE"]

 I wish I was as adventurous and daring.  But I see an interesting story for Pagoda World where we all can relive your adventure from our "armchairs" As they say, take "copious notes"

jb

[roymil]

OK Ed, you're no rookie then, not worried a bit about you.  I was concerned about a newby from back east not being ready for the desert.   Go have some fun!    Goblin valley state park is worth a stop in Utah for a few hours if you are heading over from Arches via 24 to highway 12 on way to Cap Reef.  Many blow by it because its *only* a state park, but a cool place to checkout.   

Also in Colorado there are some incredible places on the western slope.   Everyone checks out Estes park and Pikes peak on the eastern range but the western slope gets overlooked.   Google Grand Mesa if you are coming east from Denver on I-80.  It's a massive mesa averaging 10,000 feet with 200 mountain lakes, good fishing, lots of cool pine forests, few people, minimal lodging, and a fun twisty road through it south to Delta.  Once up there you should checkout a place called lands end with a view for 500 miles.   If you end up on the further south route through colorado springs then take some cool roads through alamosoa, pagosa springs and spend a day or two in Durango or even loop up to Silverton or over to Telluride.  The San Juan Mountains will be cool and snow will be melted and beautiful by July.   That area is more rugged and beautiful than the eastern slope and without as many people.   No intersates but good roads, mostly 2 lanes or nice divided highways.

If you end up still further south then definitely go through SantaFe and spend a day or two.   High enough to be cool, plenty of really good food and fancy people to look at,   think beverly hills in the mountains, well those are barely hills at 7Kft, but nice country.   From there you could head north via Taos to Durango and then west and over to Moab or meander south to the north rim of the grand canyon.   95% of people go to the south rim but the north rim is much more remote and higher elevation, so much cooler.  lots of hiking and some forest service lodges in the area too. keep your gas tank full in that country. and did I say bring water? lots and lots of water ;-)
 
above all, have some fun!

[Ed Riefstahl]

Hello again Mark,

Thanks for the great information. My wife and I are making a log of information, so when we are heading into a certain area, we can plan things. There is also a web site for Mom & Pop hotels. We plan to check some out.

A little side note of interest for some of you reading this. My wife and I have taken many road trips in Ms Magoo over the last 22 years. We have an older US road atlas that we take with us. My wife takes a different color highlighter for each trip and traces out our route, page by page. The old atlas is getting pretty beat up. We're talking about purchasing a large road map of the US and trace each trip in a different color and labeling each different year.

Mark, thank you so much for sharing this information with us. This is just what we are looking for. We'd really like to discover some new and interesting places.

Ed & Clover Riefstahl "Cruising the back roads of America, one mile at a time".
Erie, PA

1966 230SL (Ms Magoo) Horizon Blue
1970 280S (Miss Daisy)
1999 BMW Z3 5 speed
1991 BMW 318I 5 Speed
1997 Toyota Paseo Convertible - One of 1000, (have you ever seen one?)
1997 Ford Ranger step side (Mater)
2023 Mazda CX 5

[mdsalemi]

Hi Ed,

As one who has mainly taken longer road trips in my Pagoda, let me tell you what I would do. All of my road trips had commonalities: they were nearly always in summer or close to it; all involved extensive highway travel, generally at 65-75 MPH and 4,000 RPM...and with little exception, were mostly problem free.

Here's what I'd do for the NEXT trip, generally a couple of weeks prior:

1. Change the common fluids if they are due. Oil, coolant, transmission fluid. Carry a few oil filters with you, you may want to change oil enroute.
2. Put the car on a lift and check and replace all rubber exhaust donuts.
3. Check all your fan belts and ensure you carry spares with you.
4. While the car is on the lift, check for leaks anywhere. Tighten transmission and oil pans if necessary, consider gasket change if mandated.
5. Check integrity of under-connections: fuel lines, clamps, wiring to transmission, etc.
6. Check integrity of all connections to fuel feed pump at rear of car: electrical and mechanical and fuel.
7. Grease all those zerks.

With a car on a lift, you'd be surprised at how many little details may need your attention when you start looking.

Typically I just got in the car and drove. One potential problem in 2006 was with wiring to the fuel pump, happy to have gotten home. More recently my exhaust system. I guess my luck was way too good!

Not surprisingly, all those checkpoints are what my father used to do before we went on vacation in the summer back in the 1960s...but in an American car.

[Ed Riefstahl]

Hi Michael,

Thanks for the suggestions. We have traveled over 60,000 miles in our 230SL and almost entirely back roads. The last extensive trip was in 2014. We traveled 7000 miles from Erie, PA to San Francisco, and through the Dakotas on return trip. This does not include the other two Pagoda's, two BMW Z3's, MG, Fiat 850 etc. that we have spent the last 48 years cruising back roads in.

While we were regaining our health. Ms Magoo was in our attached garage, on our little lift for 11 months. So, while my wife was recovering and going through chemo, she slept a lot. It was therapy for me to work on our car and it also didn't disturb her. After dropping the rear axle to repair it, one thing led to another and a year later I just about rebuilt the whole car.

Here is a list of what I did to our 230SL.
R & R rear differential & axles, including packing bearings, new seals and replaced split boot with one pc. boot.
Installed a re-manufactured transmission from Sun Valley Mercedes Transmissions.
R & R drive shaft and replaced U-joints and support bearing.
Complete new brake system, including master cylinder, rear cylinders, calipers, flexible brake hoses etc.
Complete new cooling system, including water pump, hoses and new radiator.
All new rubber body mounts, including rear rubber spring mounts.
New exhaust system, including rubber donuts.
New alternator, including belts.
New starter motor.
New motor mounts & sway bar linkage.
New gas shocks,
Adjusted valves.
Changed injector pump oil and new fuel filter.
Changed oil, oil filter, air filter, and grease all fittings.
New cap, & rotor, non-resistor spark plugs arrived yesterday.
New right side mirror is on it's way.
4 new white wall tires to be mounted this week.
And what ever else I'm forgetting.

We also have on hand, on the shelf in the garage, a complete new interior, including carpet, sun visors, door panels, soft top etc. We will take our trip west before we redo the interior a 2nd time. The sun has faded the navy blue interior in 22 plus years & 60,000 miles of top down cruising.

Ed & Clover Riefstahl "Cruising the back roads of America, one mile at a time".

1966 230SL (Ms Magoo) Horizon Blue
1970 280S (Miss Daisy)
1999 BMW Z3 5 speed
1991 BMW 318I 5 Speed
1997 Toyota Paseo Convertible - One of 1000, (have you ever seen one?)
1997 Ford Ranger step side (Mater)
2023 Mazda CX 5

[mdsalemi]

Ed--sounds like you got it MORE than covered!
I can only say that it was many years of good luck why something didn't fail me enroute somewhere. I don't think about getting in my daily driver and driving to my dad's (14 hours straight through) but I'll be a little more cautious with the Pagoda on future trips! I got off pretty easy with my exhaust debacle on the way to PagodaFest Chicago, all things considered.

Enjoy the drive on those backroads.

[cfm65@me.com]

Ed and Clover,
I salute you.
Wishing you a safe and adventurous trip.
Regards
Chris
Cape Town

[Ed Riefstahl]

Michael,

You are so right. Many years of good luck. In the 22 years and 60k of driving Magoo all over the country, we've only had a few times where the car let us down.
Once on our way to Tennessee, we sprung a leak in a rubber fuel line. A State Police officer went to a near by NAPA and bought us some fuel line and clamps. He wouldn't take any money either.

We've had the fuel pump let us down twice.
1st time it just died 1/4 mile from my house, so I replaced it. 2nd time I somehow got a small pc. of grit under the impeller inside the pump. It actually bent one of the fins. I was a mile from my house. I removed the back plate, straightened the fin and put the plate back on. It's still working fine. I did just finish rebuilding a spare short pump from my 280SE parts car. It will now go with me.

In the late summer of 22, the yoke broke in the differential. This was catastrophic, but happened only 15 miles from my home. We had to have it flat bedded, while all the neighbors watched. This started the whole rebuilding listed above.

I really do appreciate the feed back and some very good advice. You sound a little like my dad. He sure was a good one for giving me good advice. He'd say Ed, "it's not the things that you do that you'll regret the most, it's the things that you didn't do".

I will admit, I'm a little more nervous this time. Getting older, I guess.
Kind regards,

Ed & Clover Riefstahl "Cruising the back roads of America, one mile at a time".

1966 230SL (Ms Magoo) Horizon Blue
1970 280S (Miss Daisy)
1999 BMW Z3 5 speed
1991 BMW 318I 5 Speed
1997 Toyota Paseo Convertible - One of 1000, (have you ever seen one?)
1997 Ford Ranger step side (Mater)
2023 Mazda CX 5

[Jack the Knife]

Just some ideas about the general area in which you're traveling. Over the winter, I covered about 14,000 miles on the odometer between Vero Beach and Vancouver Island with many stops between. I doubled back a few times to a couple places since a friend flew over from Japan unexpectedly to join me from the California to Washington leg. Seeing as you're starting from PA, I didn't cover a lot of your area (though I am about to within a few days).

It can't be understated how dull some of the drive west of the Mississippi until canyon country is. But if you could, I'd trend downward towards Arkansas and perhaps make a stop or two in Tulsa and OKC. I was very impressed with the Crystal Bridges Museum in Bentonville and would recommend it to any lover of art and architecture. There's a great hotel there, too, which I also found to be a good value at under $200 at the time I stayed -- the 21C location there. Fayetteville is also nice as far as college towns go with a nice slice of Americana. I'd also recommend Eureka Springs in that area. Saw a nice fintail there, as an aside.

The land between OKC and Santa Fe is mostly desolate. I'd follow the advice of some of the other posters here, though it sounds like you are a very well-seasoned road tripper and you'd prepare accordingly. Santa Fe is an outstanding town. I quite liked the El Rey Court there -- I tried to go out of my way to stay at the old restored motor lodges on my trip. It's hard to go wrong with the options there, though. Taos is in a transition right now, though. Still worth stopping, but it's a bit rough with all the construction at the moment. The road between Santa Fe and Taos via Chimayo and Panasco should not be missed. It will seem especially sublime after the prairielands so desecrated by regressive farming practices of yesteryear and the oil companies.

Durango was mentioned by another poster -- great stop. I like the Strater Inn there. There's a fun little narrow gauge railroad with a steam locomotive on it that travels between it and Silverton. A few Vero Beachers have places out there and I could see why. It hasn't been overtaken by potheads and whatnot like much of the rest of Colorado. Between it and Taos is the ruins in Aztec NM which is very much worth visiting if you have an interest in the native pueblo culture of the place.

The food in Moab is mostly terrible and the hotels are mostly dismal, but the newish Hoodoo Moab is great. I'd pack food from a decent grocery store in Durango. Hate Utah so can't help you there. You should consider the drive up to Bozeman, though. That's a fantastic town.. and it won't remain the way it does for much longer as it continues to Naples-ify. Great fly fishing and hiking in that area. Well, there's lots of great things. The Kimpton there is a quality hotel.

Around Wyoming, Jackson is really just an ossified tourist town like Aspen or whatever. The National Museum of Wildlife Art is superb, lots of great hotels, as well. I liked the Virginian, to keep with my motor lodge theme. Most of Wyoming is a very empty country. If you have a hankering to cross the alpine desert to Oregon, consider a stop in Ashland -- that's a great little town. The people I met there seemed to have a good quality of life. Great place if you like Shakespeare, too... the corridor between there and Ferndale is God's country, as they say (except Medford and Redding which both suck).

If you find yourself in Arizona, maybe a stop in Arcosanti near Prescott. Bisbee is also an interesting old mining town down near the border but probably way out of the way for you.

But man. Santa Fe. That's a great town, and one of the few places to ever make me consider leaving Florida aside La Jolla and Karuizawa JP.

PM me if you'd like specific recommendations for things.

[Ed Riefstahl]

Hi Jack,

Thanks for the great tour and even a great map. My wife and I have been all over the US several times in various vehicles including a Z3 and Ms Magoo our 66 230SL. There are so many places we liked that it's nearly impossible to name them, however Canyon Lands is at the top of the list.

This time we were planning to spend a couple weeks exploring the Canyon Lands area and no further south than possibly the very northern part of Arizona. However with the current heat wave across the country and especially in the areas we were planning to go, we have had to re-think our road trip.

We sure had our hearts set on the road trip in our SL, however our SL has no AC. We're both recovering from some health issues that are causing us some hesitation. We're sad to report, but it looks like we may head north to the New England states instead of west. We're still not sure what we are doing, but Utah and Canyon Lands will likely not be where we're headed.

We actually just had 4 new tires put on the SL Tuesday. That was the last thing to do to the car. Well, one thing's for sure, Ms Magoo isn't going to be sitting in our garage, you can be sure of that.

Thanks again for all the great information. We will save it for a later trip.

Ed & Clover Riefstahl "Cruising the back roads of America, one mile at a time".

1966 230SL (Ms Magoo) Horizon Blue
1970 280S (Miss Daisy)
1999 BMW Z3 5 speed
1991 BMW 318I 5 Speed
1997 Toyota Paseo Convertible - One of 1000, (have you ever seen one?)
1997 Ford Ranger step side (Mater)
2023 Mazda CX 5

[mmizesko]

Ed,

While I'm sure you have done all the correct pre-trip maintenance, You may consider sending a pm to JA17 here in Columbus, OH, offer lunch, and see if he would be willing to listen under your hood for a brief 15 minute peek before you undertake such a big journey.  I don't want to volunteer Joe, but that is what I'd do if I was going to drive mine 10,000 miles. Great fossils in WY on the way.

Have a glorious excursion and take lots of pictures for Pagoda World.

Mike Mizesko

[Ed Riefstahl]

Hey Mike,

Please read my comments preceding yours on this thread.
My wife and I have decided to postpone our trip to Utah and Canyon Lands due to extreme heat wave in that area of the country. We are planning to head to the Finger Lakes region of NY and maybe further up into the New England states.

Our favorite thing to do for 48 years, is to "find a road we've never been on before". There are still plenty, so Ms Magoo will get to stretch her legs a bit anyway.

Ed Riefstahl & Clover Riefstahl "cruising the back roads of America, one mile at a time".

1966 230SL (Ms Magoo) Horizon Blue
1970 280S (Miss Daisy)
1999 BMW Z3 5 speed
1991 BMW 318I 5 Speed
1997 Toyota Paseo Convertible - One of 1000, (have you ever seen one?)
1997 Ford Ranger step side (Mater)
2023 Mazda CX 5

[mmizesko]

Ed,  there are some cool places in western New York to consider.  I love Letchworth State Park Gorge, nice waterfalls.  Of course Watkins Glen and the finger lakes, and once you get into the Hudson valley, plenty of historical sites and beautiful old towns. Then north to Lake Placid, Lake Champlain, and Vermont.  Not sure your Pagoda would want to do the Mt. Washington road climb in New Hampshire, but just beautiful stuff.

Travel well.

Mike

[Mike Hughes]

I second Letchworth State Park - wonderful place, the Grand Canyon of the East.  As for Mt. Washington, if my M.G.TF could do the road to the top with no issues, any Pagoda in decent order should have no trouble at all . . .