Author Topic: Maybe I need a big push - floorpan rust  (Read 3719 times)

n/a

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Maybe I need a big push - floorpan rust
« on: December 20, 2005, 23:58:14 »
I posted in the New Member Introductions and will repeat some of it here with the hope that your feedback will help.
 I'm considering a 64 230SL. I am really having trouble accepting some rust issues with this one. A so-so restore was done about 16 years ago. The front passenger floor pan has one rusted through point which should easily be overlooked at this price point of probably $7500 as I know the owner. Hard and soft tops.
Lots of undercoating on the the tops and bottoms of the floor pans makes it very difficult to determine the extent of the rust. I have researched replacement floor panels etc. I do not weld and have no idea of labor cost for pan replacements. Gearbox is sloppy, engine has a very faint knock...piston slap ?
I just cannot decide yet. Someone give me a big push ! Based on the prices SL rust buckets fetch on EBay etc. it seems like a worthy investment. Some links to pics here: Comments ? Please and thank you
Carl
Seattle WA

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y244/alotawatts/sl1.jpg
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y244/alotawatts/sl2.jpg
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http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y244/alotawatts/sl5.jpg
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y244/alotawatts/sl6.jpg
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y244/alotawatts/sl8.jpg
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y244/alotawatts/sl9.jpg
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y244/alotawatts/sl10.jpg
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y244/alotawatts/sl11.jpg
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y244/alotawatts/sl12.jpg
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y244/alotawatts/sl13.jpg

Kenneth Gear

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Re: Maybe I need a big push - floorpan rust
« Reply #1 on: December 21, 2005, 07:31:19 »
That's a tough one.  I guess it depends on what your goal is.  If  you're seeking to buy it and have fun with it for a few years in its current condition, then it may be a good price.   But if you plan to restore it to a solid driver and keep it long term... I'm not so sure the economics work as well.

I think you have to assume the rust is extensive (it almost always is).  If you don't do that type of work yourself, it can be very expensive to fix.  I would guess that replacing the floor pans alone is going to run $3K-$5K.  If the  frame, cross member, other body panels have similar issues that obviously goes up and up and up.

Bottom line is I don't think you can buy this car for $7,500 and  fix the rust and mechnical issues for under $20,000 (in fact it could be much more than that).  Therefore, I would pass on this car and look for a tired but rust free example in the $20K range and tinker with the mechanicals and cosmetic issues over time to make it a really nice car after some TLC.  At least mechanicals and cosmetic issues have a quanitfiable cost for each fix.  Fixing rust has almost no upper limit on cost.

Best of luck

Ken G
1971 280 SL
Silver/red
Ken G
1971 280 SL Silver/red

Tom

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Re: Maybe I need a big push - floorpan rust
« Reply #2 on: December 21, 2005, 07:40:55 »
I agree with Ken.   I would view the $7,500 as a small down payment on what you will ultimately spend.  Finding someone who can do the welding right without having recurring rust issues is a hit or miss scenario.

Undercoating-especially when thick, on both sides of the pan is not a good sign.  There are too many nice cars out there that, while not cheap, will not suck money out of your wallet other than when you buy the car.

This sounds like a car to pass on.

Best,

Tom

1971 280sl Tunis Beige Metallic (restored & enhanced)
1971 280sl Tobacco Brown (low mileage stock)
1970 280sl Deep Red (Project Car)
« Last Edit: December 21, 2005, 07:43:43 by Tom »
1971 280sl Tunis Beige Metallic

waltklatt

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Re: Maybe I need a big push - floorpan rust
« Reply #3 on: December 21, 2005, 08:33:16 »
Carl,
While looking at the pictures and your description, it seems that this car is a bit much to handle for that price.
Depending on your level of repair work on these cars, this one will require a lot to bring it back to a good tick.
Engine noise-piston slap meaning the lower end is worn, an engine out job.  You didnt mention anything about how the car was cared for, what kind of people drive the car, oil changes, maintenance, etc.
Best to have an expert look over the car to determine it's true heritage.  Also best to put it up on a lift to look at the undersides.  Trunk?-no clue to how it looks(should have the vertical spare tire)  Sloppy gearbox means the bushings are worn.  Blistering paint on the fenders means the underlying paint has reacted to the top coating of paint and lost it's adhesion-total strip to bare metal required to fix.  Rust issues-obviously the owner has something to hide.  Look for the jack points and try the original jack to lift the car.  If you hear any crunching or groaning of metal when lifting the car with the jack, stop and let it down again-metal is rusted through behind the rocker covers.
Also if you cant get the car onto a lift then I would simply lay down on some cardboard sheet just before the rear wheels and reach under the floor in front of the rear wheels and feel the chassis frame just before it swings upward over the axle-should be smooth with the undercoating, if it's rough or has jagged edges or a hole then it's rusted through.
Just a few pointers that should help you determine the buy or not.  Do not go with your emotions for the purchase.  Walk away and come back later when you have thought it out.
There are plenty of others out there to pick from, just takes time.
Happy Holidays to all!
Walter Klatt
1967 220SL-diesel
1963 230SL-gas

J. Huber

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Re: Maybe I need a big push - floorpan rust
« Reply #4 on: December 21, 2005, 10:28:16 »
I'd be inclined to push you the other way. As the others have said, alot depends on your goal. It appears that you will need to do (and spend) quite a bit to get it even to the "pleasurable driver" status. I'd look for something with minimal (or no?) rust, a good history, and signs of general TLC. Probably in the high teens, low 20s. Remember, these cars have always been treasures (MBZ name has been equated with quality/status for a long time). Yes nature takes its course in some cases, but to those with any semblence of car sense -- they would have fought back some to keep the car decent.

James
63 230SL
James
63 230SL

norton

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Re: Maybe I need a big push - floorpan rust
« Reply #5 on: December 21, 2005, 10:56:23 »
Carl I go along with the rest of group. Trying to buy a cheap Pagoda, Ain't cheap.  You will spend tens of thousands of dollars trying to make this into a good car. My car is apart right now for paint and an interior color change. The car looked ok and drove well when I got it, so I thought paint and interior maybe $6000.00 bucks (I do my own body and paint work)Now that I take a good look at the project (and other group members cars) I need to get most of the chrome redone, since the engine is coming out for the paint job might as well get it freshened up, and while I'm at it detail the motor compartment and undersides and on and on, Now I'm looking at $25000 to $30000.00 dollars and I'm doing allmost all the work my self, and this will not be a restored show car, just a nice driver.  Spend the money and buy a nice one to begin with, unless your looking for a very expensive hobby. :)

Mike Halleck
Chesterfield Mi
71 280SL
68 250SL (parts car)
94 E320 Coupe
« Last Edit: December 21, 2005, 10:58:31 by norton »

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Re: Maybe I need a big push - floorpan rust
« Reply #6 on: December 21, 2005, 12:35:24 »
Thanks to all for sharing your info.