Rough Yardstick: What Should It Cost For Paint Job

[JPMOSE]

I am considering repainting my car. It is absolutely rust free. I am not interested in showing it...even if it was 100 points. The door jambs and under the hood are in great shape and can be left alone (but may be interested in under the hood if reasonable). I would want all the mouldings removed. No color change (car is DB291 Dark Olive). There are dings but no dents anywhere.

I understand the hard top is quite a chore to remove the moldings.  I know not removing the moldings would be a sin...but are there any in particular that are harder to remove that may drive to cost way up?

What should I expect to pay for a very nice, but not Concours paint job? I am budgeting between $5k and $9k...am I in the ballpark or just dreaming?

I really wanted to keep to original paint since I basically just drive it and don't show it.  However, the left quarter panel was repainted by the dealer in 1971 due to a big scratch (no dents).  They did a horrible job and there are micro bumps all over the panel.  :evil:  If it wasn't for this I could be happy with using the Dent Wizard and keeping the original paint.  Yet the more I look at the car, the more flaws I find.  I thought about just painting the quarter panel but am afaid it will stick out like a sore thumb.

Any advice will be appreciated...I keep going back and forth on this one.


Best Regards,

J. P. Mose
1968 250SL
1987 560SL

[KevinC]

JP-

My local good quality-but-not-concours shop ballparked a repaint on my 113 at about $10,000 to $12,000. That included stripping to bare metal and r&r'ing removing all chrome and rubber. They suggested that it would be at this level because they would likely have to deal with broken/rusted fasteners, and who knows what underneath the paint that was on the car. Also, stripping and prepping the aluminum parts would require extra additional care. Soooooo, for $1,200, I had my problem quarter panel re-sprayed (perfect match due to a camera from DuPont, I believe), a local "ding specialist" remove 17 dings (!!!), a number of chips touched up and then an overall agressive paint cleaning and waxing. The result...an exceptionally clean appearing "driver" for about $2k worth of investment PLUS probably about three months of driving the car as opposed to it being stuck in the body shop.


Kevin Caputo
Boca Raton, FL
1967 230 SL Automatic
670 Light Ivory
113 Bronze/Brown MB Tex
2007 Lava Gray Audi Q7

[Cees Klumper]

I suppose there will be a significant difference if the old paint is to be removed, vs spraying over the existing paint. In 2001 I did the latter, had some minor rust repair work done (including a rear fender lip repair panel) and had them weld-shut the side marker holes. I did the removal and re-installation of trim work myself, they did the remaining prepping and painting/polishing, and they perfectly matched the shade of white that was on the car (not the original color, which was blue). It ended up costing $900 (not a typo), although at the other place I had them do an estimation, they came up with $9,000 (also not a typo). Probably the quality of the $9,000 job would have been better, but not by a factor of 10. Then what I always say: "it pays to shop around".

Kevin's advice is what I would also suggest: try to save the original paint by having them closely match the color for, and redo, the one panel, and 'treating' the dings.

Good luck!

Cees ("Case") Klumper in Amsterdam
'69 white 280 SL automatic

[jameshoward]

Cees,

I've read about your paint job many times and can perfectly understand why you are understandably most pround. Is your paint shop still in business, or has it gone bust? If they are still around, I would seriously consider driving to your shop (I live in Germany, about 3-ish hours from Amsterdam) and could take the train home!! I'm just scoping options, because in winter 07 if the opportunity (and money) existed I would be interested in getting my car repainted the colour I want (which is not the original colour that it is now). By what magnitude do you think the cost would increase if I delivered the car with as much of the periferal stuff removed but with them having to do a bit more than they did for your stripped down car?

I realise that questions dont come much vaguer than this, but if you have a view I'd like to hear it.

Thanks,

James

[enochbell]

JP,

Just another experience to consider:

My very good but definately not show paint job cost 6k, which included 1k of dent repair.  No rust. Stripped to bare metal.  The paint shop did not touch any trim, I was responsible for all R&R.  Included dash and jams but, and now I really regret this, not the engine bay.  They wanted another 5k if I gave them responsibility for trim, and I was just as happy to save the $ and do it myself.

BTW, I have seen Kevin C's matched paint.  I would not have thought you could do this, but the match really is invisible.  Something about a special camera as I recall.

Best,
g

'64 230sl, fully sorted out...ooops, spoke too soon

[dldubois]

J.P.

I stripped all the chrome from my car including the dash chrome.   My painter then stripped the car, removed the windshield, removed the hardtop chrome, did body work (Just door dings, etc) and repainted original 906 blue.   He painted the underside of the hood, in the trunk, underside of trunk lid, convertible bay and the car and my cost was $7400 using Glasurit paint.  

I still have to replace the headliner and get the hardtop back together but will shortly.

He also replaced a few of the chrome items for me.



Dana DuBois
1969 280sl
Corinth, TX

[JPMOSE]

After reading through the responses so far, I think I am going to aim for my original plan (similar to Kevin's response) and have the quarter panel repainted only.  I will continue with the Dent Wizard and hope they are able to reach all the dings from the back side.  At the end of day, I really want a nice appearing "driver" that is very original.

I saw this or similar advertised in a Mercedes Performance Products catalog:

http://drcolorchip.com/

Has anyone had any experience with this or something similar?

Best Regards,

J. P. Mose
1968 250SL
1987 560SL

[paul in Arizona]

At a car show I asked hot rod owners who did their paint and came up with a guy who did great work.  I stripped the car of most of the trim; he took it down to bare metal; fixed a few dings and repainted for around $4300.  
The down side is that this is a busy collision shop and they did "fancy" work as time permitted.  His original estimate was that it would take a month or a bit more.  I got the car back in 6 months, looking wonderful.  A long wait but it probably saved me a couple of grand.

[mdsalemi]

Hello All,

Cees did well, presumably, at USD $900.  Make no mistake though--particularly if the word "Glasurit" is on your mind.  $900 won't even pay for the wholesale cost of the Glasurit materials to paint a 113.

It is a lot of work to strip a car to bare metal, no matter how you do it or who does it; expect to pay dearly for this.  Then, of course, you have considerably more materials and considerably more prep.

The best thing to do is search out local vendors who have good repuations.  Your local car clubs--MB, BMW, Porsche, etc. all know who the shops to frequent are as well as those to avoid.  Like many things, some homework is in order.

Michael Salemi
1969 280SL
Signal Red w/Black Leather
Restored

[ted280sl]

I had my car painted several years ago. I shopped it around for several months. I believe I can share some useful information on this topic.
1. Removing the bumpers, lights and body chrome is really not difficult. The clips will break and they can be replaced. The clips are not expensive. I did not remove the chrome from the hardtop or around the windshield.
2. If you are not in a hurry you wil save money. My car took 4 weeks instead of two.
3. The better shops have computer color paint matching. The new paint is more durabe than our original paint.
I hope this is useful.
Ted 1969 280SL

[glcg123]

The key to a great paint job is prep and the skill of the painter. I have seen fantastic work come out of a small shop and also seen poor work out of so-called specialty shops. My shop uses Sikkens which is a good paint system. All of the new base coat/clearcoat manufacturers have to be good or they would not be in business. The advantage of base/clear is for the shop to more easily match colour and speed the painting process. Time is money.

A friend of mine restored a 1970 muscle car. He spent $12,000-$14,000 on the paint job which included sending it outo get stripped to bar emeatl and then entirely dipped in some type of metal prep before the repaint. This was done in Minneapolis. Do I think it is great job - not for the money he spent. My guy at the Audi dealership does better work.

I am fortunate that my 1965 230SL has original enamel which cannot be duplicated. It is in excellent shape. Enamels are every difficult to purchase today due to environmental regulations. Hence they are no longer used. I was able to get a small bottle of touch up paint 2 years ago which is a dead match for my Papyrus white. The advantage of enamel is that the touchup will harden like the paint. Basecoats need a top coat of say clear nail polish to protect the base coat.

The best advice I have is to visit a shop you are thinking of working with, ask questions, observe, and check out the finished work. You will soon tell who is up to your standard.

My little bit of knowledge.

George

1965 230SL 4spd

[Cees Klumper]

Hello James - yes, the shop is still in business. My best friend had his older-BMW painted there (the lower half, not the upper) about 9 months ago, along with rust repairs to door panels and the rear valance and some other places, for all of $700. Then I went there a couple of months ago to inquire about a repair to the rear valance on my Pagoda. They will do it "for not very much" so I bought the repair panel from Van Dijk. It is sitting in my wife's studio (she is a painter and, besides oil and acrylic paints, oftentimes uses ... enamel car paint! from Sikkens - at around $90 a liter this is expensive stuff. But at least in Europe it is still available in any color you wish for) waiting for me to make the appointment to have the work done. Peter van Es' Pagoda needs the exact same repair, so we will be going in with both cars at the same time for a 'package deal'.
If you are serious about coming over, I can ask the proprietor about what the cost of a total repaint would be these days (I am sure not that much more than 5 years ago) and let you know, just send me an email. I will buy you a Heineken before you take the train trip home. You will most likely save a lot of money this way. Oh, by the way, you can walk from the shop to Amsterdam Central Station, it's quite close-by.

Cees ("Case") Klumper in Amsterdam
'69 white 280 SL automatic

[Raymond]

I've had the honor of driving Cees' car and the paint condition is lovely.  

I had the engine out of my car in summer 2005 and used the opportunity to have the car stripped and re-painted in the engine bay as well as everthing else.  I waited 10 weeks for the shop I had chosen to get an opening.  Once they took her in, they took about three weeks.  I had removed all of the chrome except the hard top and windshield posts.  He stripped and hand painted 5 wheelcovers too. The total was just under $3500.  

The fellow who did the work was someone who was doing custom work for tuners and muscle cars.  His freehand flame work was really pretty.  I saw him match the metallic orange on the hood of a truck with a 3 year-old paint job.  Get recommendations, look at the color matching work and look at the body work of cars in process.  Also, ask him if there is anything special about working on aluminum.  If he doesn't think so, politely move on.

Ray
'68 280SL 4-spd Coupe

[jameshoward]

Cees,

Thanks for your response. I am serious about it. I need to update my TUV thread, as much has happened since Dec 06. My mechanic collects the car tomorrow, so I'll know what needs to be done, That will give me an idea of how much is left for a possible re-spray. I'll get back to you.

James

[Cees Klumper]

OK James, I'll start chilling the Heinekens. Looking forward to meeting you,

Cees ("Case") Klumper in Amsterdam
'69 white 280 SL automatic

[J. Huber]

Hello. I picked this lucky thread to ask a couple paint-related questions. The car has a urethane/clearcoat. First, can somebody explain how in certain lights and angles, I see waves and dimples on the body but if I get up to the car, the body and paint are glassy & smooth? You can probably put a straight edge on it. It's pretty true. Is it some kind of skim coat? Second, if a first-rate body shop were to take on such a car for a repaint -- can they eliminate these waves? Thanks as always.

James
63 230SL

[rwmastel]

quote:Originally posted by J. Huber

I see waves and dimples on the body but if I get up to the car, the body and paint are glassy & smooth?

Waves that are measured in several per inch or several along the length of the door?

Rodd
Powell, Ohio, USA
1966 230SL, Euro, Auto, Leather, both  tops
1994 E420

[J. Huber]

Hey Rodd. I'd say they are very small but plentiful. Likely previous door dings, etc. I can't really explain it -- you can not see them from 2-5 feet away. Or when touching the car. But if you get in just the right light and from an angle 20 feet behind the car, you see them "under the skin."

James
63 230SL

[Douglas]

James,

Waviness in body panels can be from a couple of factors and can even be found in replacement body panels that are brand new. This is one of the ways you can judge the quality of the parts used as well as the workmanship of the resto shop.

Generally, factory body panels are going to be much better and less wavy to begin with. The overall shape will be more accurate and require less fitting and the metal will be thicker and more durable. (The price will generally be a lot higher too, of course.) Body shops will compensate for any waviness found in the panels with filler. They "mud up" the sides and block-sand it out to flatten it. This takes time and a good eye.

You can also get a sort of waviness from the paint unevenly drying and shrinking up in patches. This often happens over time.

I'm no expert on this, but I hope I've answered your question.

Douglas Kim
New York
USA

[J. Huber]

Thanks Douglas. It makes perfect sense to me. You see, I had the car painted years ago -- and it had plenty of dings then. Now it has very few dings (except those old ones lurking under the skin!) It was a fairly cheapo paint job, although it still looks pretty okay to me 10 years later...

James
63 230SL