Steering is a bit vague... normal?

[scoot]

Hello -

I'm getting to know the 250SL that I recently acquired.  It's a driver car not a show car and never will be a show car.   The previous owner had the engine (and I don't know what else) rebuilt and it seems to run well.  Unfortunately he parked it outside in the rain for a long time and there are various rust issues and drainage issues that I'm working on discovering.

Regarding the driving/steering:  The car seems to wander a bit.  The power steering works well and nothing makes any strange noises, I just notice that a certain amount of "correction" is required.  Is this normal, or is there something worn/out of adjustment (some strange shock absorber thing?) that I need to address?   I'm also wondering if the 10+ year old tires could be a factor.  Those get replaced soon.

thanks
Scott

[jeffc280sl]

The steering should be tight and responsive with little or no play in the steering wheel.  I suggest you look at the steering linkage.  The attached images may help.  If is wanders on a flat surface an alignment may help.

Good luck

Download Attachment: steerplay1.jpg
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Download Attachment: steerplay.jpg
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Jeff C.
1970 280SL 4-speed

[waqas]

Regarding your car's wanderlust, possible culprits include (in no particular order):

• worn idler arm bushing
• play in steering box
• ball-joints shot (tie rod ends, drag link)
• worn steering coupling bushings
• poor rear-axle alignment
• bad rear-axle centre-mount

All of these have been covered here, so if you use our nifty 'search' function, you can find a ton of useful information. Try "steering play" or other keywords like that.

I wouldn't drive too far with those old tyres. I once had a tyre de-tread on me... no fun.

Waqas in Austin, Texas

[Mike Hughes]

Don't forget to check the steering damper.  It is absolutely amazing the difference in steering "feel" and tracking between a Pagoda with a good steering damper and one with a steering damper that is shot.

The steering damper is the device that looks like a shock absorber that parallels the tie rods under the engine. One end is bolted to a bracket on the frame; one end is bolted to the steering rods.  To check the steering damper simply unbolt the end that is attached to the steering rods.  Then work the shaft in and out of the damper housing.  If it is stiff and difficult to move both in and out and it is not leaking, you have a good damper.  If it moves freely with little effort in either or both directions, or is leaking, then it is toast - replace it!

- Mike Hughes  -ô¿ô-
  1966 230SL Auto P/S
  Havanna Brown (408)
  Light Beige (181)
  Cream M-B Tex (121)

[scoot]

quote:Originally posted by waqas

Regarding your car's wanderlust, possible culprits include (in no particular order):

• worn idler arm bushing
• play in steering box
• ball-joints shot (tie rod ends, drag link)
• worn steering coupling bushings
• poor rear-axle alignment
• bad rear-axle centre-mount

All of these have been covered here, so if you use our nifty 'search' function, you can find a ton of useful information. Try "steering play" or other keywords like that.

I wouldn't drive too far with those old tyres. I once had a tyre de-tread on me... no fun.

Waqas in Austin, Texas

I'm fairly sure it's (at least) free play in the steering box.  When I'm sitting in the car I can turn the wheel about 2 inches back and forth before it makes contact with anything -- I can here it - metal-to-metal contact as I move the wheel back and forth.  After I hear it, there is resistance and it actually turns the wheels.  I'll search the forum for what to do about free play...   thanks.

[DaveB]

If you have someone else turn the steering wheel while you observe you should be able to track down the problem. It seems common for the 2 plastic bushes in the coupling between the steering shaft and the steering box to wear (Waqas' "worn steering coupling bushings").

[scoot]

quote:Originally posted by DaveB

If you have someone else turn the steering wheel while you observe you should be able to track down the problem. It seems common for the 2 plastic bushes in the coupling between the steering shaft and the steering box to wear (Waqas' "worn steering coupling bushings").

Yes, we did that.  One of us turns the wheel, the other observes.  And the sound comes from where the steering shaft meets the steer box, which has/had me a bit paniced given that at a minimum the BBB says to remove the steering from the car to work on it.  But bushing/couplings between the steering shaft and the box would certainly make the problem less intimidating!!!!   I hadn't realized that the coupling bushings were located exactly where I think the sound is coming from.  THANKS.   I'll check it out further soon.

[Paddy_Crow]

I still have to do this job on my car, I've read that you can disconnect the box and pull it far enough away to replace the bushings. Also read that you have to be careful reassembling it, otherwise the turn signals won't cancel properly. You'll be pleasantly surprised when you price the bushings, they're like about $4 or $5 apiece. Of course, not much to them.

I found a few references that said you should also replace some washers, but I was not able to find anything definitive with part numbers.

[waqas]

quote:Originally posted by Paddy_Crow

I still have to do this job on my car, I've read that you can disconnect the box and pull it far enough away to replace the bushings. Also read that you have to be careful reassembling it, otherwise the turn signals won't cancel properly. You'll be pleasantly surprised when you price the bushings, they're like about $4 or $5 apiece. Of course, not much to them.

I found a few references that said you should also replace some washers, but I was not able to find anything definitive with part numbers.

Steering bushing 111 462 01 65 (2 required), plastic/nylon washer 111 990 30 40 115 990 17 40 (2 required), spring washer 900055 010000 (2 required), metal washer 136 990 95 40 124 990 41 40 (2 required).

Note: updated quantities required

[J. Huber]

Hey all. From one who knows practically nothing about this stuff -- would the steering issues and mentioned diagnosis & parts be the same for cars without power steering as well?

[waqas]

Bushings and washers are identical for manual or power steering.

[J. Huber]

Thanks Waqas! Knock on the speaker grille, I have never had any issues -- and the steering is tight. But what that also means is there are at least 20-25 year old parts in there. I have come close to buying a new steering damper -- only because it looks do-able even for me.

[Mike Hughes]

The first week I had my 230SL the steering was so scary I couldn't stand it.  Turned out to be the steering coupling.  This was also my introduction to the wealth of available parts for old Mercedes Benz cars.  The dealer across the street produced a new steering coupling in 24 hours and a Pagoda owning friend called his trusty mechanic who come over the next day and put it in for me.  It actually looked like a pretty straightforward job - if you are a contortionist and know what to take apart to get to it!

[scoot]

Well it's done.  The coupler bushings were shot and they have been replaced.  Whoever posted (somewhere) that they did this in an hour must be on a race team pit crew.  It took two of us most of a day.  (I also don't see how this can be done by one person).   It was a pain but now it's done and there is no more free play in the steering.  Thanks for posting people.

[717-113]

quote:Originally posted by waqas


Steering bushing 111 462 01 65 (2 required), plastic/nylon washer 111 990 30 40 115 990 17 40 (2 required), spring washer 900055 010000 (2 required), metal washer 136 990 95 40 124 990 41 40 (2 required).
Note: updated quantities required

Hey, I see where the bushings are, or should be, but didnt see any of the washers. where should they be?

[waqas]

quote:Originally posted by 717-113

quote:Originally posted by waqas


Steering bushing 111 462 01 65 (2 required), plastic/nylon washer 111 990 30 40 115 990 17 40 (2 required), spring washer 900055 010000 (2 required), metal washer 136 990 95 40 124 990 41 40 (2 required).
Note: updated quantities required

Hey, I see where the bushings are, or should be, but didnt see any of the washers. where should they be?

The metal washer, spring washer, and nylon washer (in that order, from front to rear of car) are placed on the forward side of the coupling attachment center piece.

Here's the picture from SLS website:
http://www.sls-hh-catalogue.de/bin/explode.phtml?lan=2&mid=IN02&tid=IN020220

The bushing is #82, the nylon washer is #81, and the two greyed-out pieces are the metal and spring washers (spring washer in the middle).

[merrill]

Thanks to diagnostic advise from waqas I found my steering coupler needed new bushings.

ordered the parts listed earlier in this thread from MB classic center, rebuilt coupler and put it all back together.

all in all not too hard.

One trick I did was to remove some of the manual steering oil so I could see the centering point on the steering gear.
lined everything up, put it together.

Thanks Waqas!!

now on to the front pads and re grease the bearings.